No, Teen Suicide Isn’t Rising Because Life Got Objectively Worse
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Re: No, Teen Suicide Isn’t Rising Because Life Got Objectively Worse
#2Notice how the problems share a common thread? It's simply better messaging from anti-capitalists.
Everyone's lives has problems, but find a way to thread them together that frames them under a unified message, and you've done a lot more to advance a message. What's not going to work is telling people their lives are actually ok, and the alternative messages, "The problem is actually you," or "That other group is making your life worse," either turn the problem inward which doesn't do anything to help suicide rates, or foments identity tensions which teens find unpalatable.
If you want teen suicide rate to fall, out-message the most powerful message. Or I mean, actually abolish capitalism and prove them wrong, or right.
Re: No, Teen Suicide Isn’t Rising Because Life Got Objectively Worse
#3I'm interested in the explanation for this:
Re: No, Teen Suicide Isn’t Rising Because Life Got Objectively Worse
#4Matthew Yglesias wrote about this today as well, and his take was interesting. Paywall though :/
https://www.slowboring.com/p/why-are-young-liberals-so-depre...
Re: No, Teen Suicide Isn’t Rising Because Life Got Objectively Worse
#5> [Lorenz] went on to suggest that the young people of the 1950s enjoyed objectively superior material prospects than young people do today
This is why I think culture is more important than policy. Lorenz’s point is obviously non-sensical. She mentions the “safety net.” But Medicaid didn’t exist in the 1950s. There were no federal student loans. There were no food stamps. Almost nobody went to college. Etc.
But it’s a mistake to say Lorenz is wrong on the facts and leave it at that. She sincerely believes that young people today are worse off than young people in the 1950s. It’s a common refrain expressed by young people.
So what has changed since the 1950s? Culture. We have made massive changes to how society is structured. We have changed what we tell young people about the meaning and purpose of life. We have eliminated social roles and duties and obligations that used to apply to young people. In many cases we have replaced those personal obligations (e.g. to take care of elders) with abstract government funded systems. And maybe those changes aren’t all conducive to the well being of young people.
Re: No, Teen Suicide Isn’t Rising Because Life Got Objectively Worse
#6Article spends entire time "debunking" a political pundit who posts "hot takes" on Twitter, doesn't interview a single teen.
Maybe, just maybe, the answer is multi-faceted. Maybe we should take the things kids say at face value if we want to pretend that we are being intellectually honest. Sure, humans are notoriously bad at describing their own qualia and reasons for why they feel the things they do, but listening should surely be our starting point, right?
Furthermore, why is it that capitalism can't both increase our material quality of life, while also alienating us from things that our ancestors enjoyed in abundance? Relationships, the family, simple and fulfilling labor that had an immediate impact on your surroundings, connection with nature, more leisure time, etc. There's no conversion ratio of semiconductor chips to time spent with loved ones. Guess which of the two humans can't live without?
Maybe instead of having a knee-jerk reaction to anti-capitalism, we should objectively look at neoliberal capitalism and see what the negative externalities are of a system that assumes the driving force between human interactions to be economic (one of which is the commodification of everything including relationships).
This article should be titled "picking a fight with Taylor Lorenz" and nothing else.
Re: No, Teen Suicide Isn’t Rising Because Life Got Objectively Worse
#7"Between 2007 and 2018, the suicide rate among Americans ages 10 to 24 increased by nearly 60 percent."
Right around the time social media garbage bloomed. Weird coincidence.
Re: No, Teen Suicide Isn’t Rising Because Life Got Objectively Worse
#8> [Lorenz] went on to suggest that the young people of the 1950s enjoyed objectively superior material prospects than young people do today This is why I think culture is more important than policy. Lorenz’s point is obviously non-sensical. She mentions the “safety net.” But Medicaid didn’t exist in the 1950s. There were no federal student loans. There were no food stamps. Almost nobody went to college. Etc. But it’s…
> So what has changed since the 1950s?
Trajectory of how well off average American will be in x years?
Re: No, Teen Suicide Isn’t Rising Because Life Got Objectively Worse
#9"Between 2007 and 2018, the suicide rate among Americans ages 10 to 24 increased by nearly 60 percent." Right around the time social media garbage bloomed. Weird coincidence.
Or post the 2008 crash where everything governments did for young people was slashed...
Re: No, Teen Suicide Isn’t Rising Because Life Got Objectively Worse
#10> [Lorenz] went on to suggest that the young people of the 1950s enjoyed objectively superior material prospects than young people do today This is why I think culture is more important than policy. Lorenz’s point is obviously non-sensical. She mentions the “safety net.” But Medicaid didn’t exist in the 1950s. There were no federal student loans. There were no food stamps. Almost nobody went to college. Etc. But it’s…
> There were no federal student loans. [..] Almost nobody went to college.
How much did college cost? How necessary was a college degree for success?