Web-based editor for Kotlin, JetBrains' new JVM language
kotlin-demo.jetbrains.com
Web-based editor for Kotlin, JetBrains' new JVM language
1–10 of 19 posts
Re: Web-based editor for Kotlin, JetBrains' new JVM language
#2Looks like a mildly cleaned up Java, was expecting something a little more interesting. Don't see much in the way of functional programming or worthwhile changes vs Java.
Was expecting a Scala competitor, but found a slightly better Java with some syntax sugar. It's "nice", but not really different enough to warrant the effort of switching to another language. As a Java dev for 10+ years Scala was an eye opener on what a language could really be, Kotlin is "nice", but sadly not that interesting.
Minor pet peave is they have retained even Java's verbosity for outputting text:
Kotlin: System.out?.println("Hi") Java: System.out.println("Hi") Scala: println("Hi") Ruby: puts("Hi")
Re: Web-based editor for Kotlin, JetBrains' new JVM language
#3Looks like a mildly cleaned up Java, was expecting something a little more interesting. Don't see much in the way of functional programming or worthwhile changes vs Java. Was expecting a Scala competitor, but found a slightly better Java with some syntax sugar. It's "nice", but not really different enough to warrant the effort of switching to another language. As a Java dev for 10+ years Scala was an eye opener on wh…
I was quite interested in Kotlin, but Xtend is already out, and does most of the interesting stuff.
I think there's definitely room for a "better Java" - most Java devs should be able to pick up Kotlin or Xtend and be more productive very quickly.
With regard to FP, I think the presence of closures is enough to do a large proportion of the things you'd want.. What do you see lacking in these?
Re: Web-based editor for Kotlin, JetBrains' new JVM language
#4Looks like a mildly cleaned up Java, was expecting something a little more interesting. Don't see much in the way of functional programming or worthwhile changes vs Java. Was expecting a Scala competitor, but found a slightly better Java with some syntax sugar. It's "nice", but not really different enough to warrant the effort of switching to another language. As a Java dev for 10+ years Scala was an eye opener on wh…
If it compiles faster than Scala I will use it!
From reading the language specs it seems much more pragmatic than Scala (as does ceylon http://www.ceylon-lang.org/ or fantom http://fantom.org/).
I think if JetBrains thought that Scala was a better Java they would be using it instead of creating their own language.
Re: Web-based editor for Kotlin, JetBrains' new JVM language
#5Looks like a mildly cleaned up Java, was expecting something a little more interesting. Don't see much in the way of functional programming or worthwhile changes vs Java. Was expecting a Scala competitor, but found a slightly better Java with some syntax sugar. It's "nice", but not really different enough to warrant the effort of switching to another language. As a Java dev for 10+ years Scala was an eye opener on wh…
I was quite interested in Kotlin, but Xtend is already out, and does most of the interesting stuff. I think there's definitely room for a "better Java" - most Java devs should be able to pick up Kotlin or Xtend and be more productive very quickly. With regard to FP, I think the presence of closures is enough to do a large proportion of the things you'd want.. What do you see lacking in these?
I'd like to see greater integration into the libraries and commonly used types. Strings in Scala for example let you perform all manner of filtering and other functional operations. Collections in Scala also support operations like map, filter and partition etc. Scala feels more like a fusion between functional and object-oriented programming, rather than a slightly prettier Java with closures.
Re: Web-based editor for Kotlin, JetBrains' new JVM language
#6Earlier quoted context omitted.
I was quite interested in Kotlin, but Xtend is already out, and does most of the interesting stuff. I think there's definitely room for a "better Java" - most Java devs should be able to pick up Kotlin or Xtend and be more productive very quickly. With regard to FP, I think the presence of closures is enough to do a large proportion of the things you'd want.. What do you see lacking in these?
I'd like to see greater integration into the libraries and commonly used types. Strings in Scala for example let you perform all manner of filtering and other functional operations. Collections in Scala also support operations like map, filter and partition etc. Scala feels more like a fusion between functional and object-oriented programming, rather than a slightly prettier Java with closures.
I think Xtend has extension methods for any Iterable that do what you want: http://download.eclipse.org/modeling/tmf/xtext/javadoc/2.0.1...
Point taken on Strings though - in this situation you'd want String to extend Iterable but it doesn't for historical reasons.
Re: Web-based editor for Kotlin, JetBrains' new JVM language
#7Earlier quoted context omitted.
I was quite interested in Kotlin, but Xtend is already out, and does most of the interesting stuff. I think there's definitely room for a "better Java" - most Java devs should be able to pick up Kotlin or Xtend and be more productive very quickly. With regard to FP, I think the presence of closures is enough to do a large proportion of the things you'd want.. What do you see lacking in these?
I'd like to see greater integration into the libraries and commonly used types. Strings in Scala for example let you perform all manner of filtering and other functional operations. Collections in Scala also support operations like map, filter and partition etc. Scala feels more like a fusion between functional and object-oriented programming, rather than a slightly prettier Java with closures.
Kotlin is in preview. They explicitly said they plan to extend java types like String and add a lot of stdlib stuff. Just don't forget that scala is 10 years old, while Kotlin is 6 months.
Re: Web-based editor for Kotlin, JetBrains' new JVM language
#8Looks like a mildly cleaned up Java, was expecting something a little more interesting. Don't see much in the way of functional programming or worthwhile changes vs Java. Was expecting a Scala competitor, but found a slightly better Java with some syntax sugar. It's "nice", but not really different enough to warrant the effort of switching to another language. As a Java dev for 10+ years Scala was an eye opener on wh…
If it compiles faster than Scala I will use it! From reading the language specs it seems much more pragmatic than Scala (as does ceylon http://www.ceylon-lang.org/ or fantom http://fantom.org/ ). I think if JetBrains thought that Scala was a better Java they would be using it instead of creating their own language.
The authors of Kotlin has explicitly said that fast compilation is a key feature.
Re: Web-based editor for Kotlin, JetBrains' new JVM language
#9Earlier quoted context omitted.
If it compiles faster than Scala I will use it! From reading the language specs it seems much more pragmatic than Scala (as does ceylon http://www.ceylon-lang.org/ or fantom http://fantom.org/ ). I think if JetBrains thought that Scala was a better Java they would be using it instead of creating their own language.
The authors of Kotlin has explicitly said that fast compilation is a key feature.
It's also one of the key features of Turbo Pascal.
Re: Web-based editor for Kotlin, JetBrains' new JVM language
#10Looks like a mildly cleaned up Java, was expecting something a little more interesting. Don't see much in the way of functional programming or worthwhile changes vs Java. Was expecting a Scala competitor, but found a slightly better Java with some syntax sugar. It's "nice", but not really different enough to warrant the effort of switching to another language. As a Java dev for 10+ years Scala was an eye opener on wh…
it has more than sugar - for example, the type system is extended to include handle nulls correctly - http://confluence.jetbrains.net/display/Kotlin/Null-safety - and it has extension functions (to solve (some of) the same kind of problems as scala's implicit conversions)
jetbrains is an interesting company. they have managed to produce a successful product (intellij idea) despite being in competition with a hugely successful open source project (eclipse). i was thinking about this just last night, when i gave up using eclipse in despair (maven nested projects, fwiw) and decided to upgrade my idea licence to the new release - it's impressive how much better it is. so they must have some smart people; i hope this works out.