Ask HN: Am I missing something (modern webdev)?

#1

Post by anxiously » Thu, Nov 24, 2022, 2:19 AM UTC

I have always tried to build web applications that load quickly, don't require JavaScript (but can be improved by it) and work on any device that supports rendering HTML and CSS.

Everywhere I turn there's a new framework or library that depends on complicated build tools, generating mountains of JavaScript and sometimes even generating HTML and CSS.

What's wrong with building simple web applications that get things done and don't require build tools, secondary (or tertiary) languages or meta-languages (like SCSS, ERB, JSX, Jade, etc)?

Re: Ask HN: Am I missing something (modern webdev)?

#2

Post by matthewwolfe » Thu, Nov 24, 2022, 2:50 AM UTC

There is not a rule that is preventing you from writing websites with JS, HTML, and CSS or even just HTML and CSS with no JS at all. Like everything else in the world, right or wrong, people have preferences for different things. Some people prefer your approach. Some feel more productive with Vue/React/Angular/etc. Some people even like writing web apps with Rust.

I personally like using React and Typescript because I feel really productive with it. I’ve built out open source libraries that I use in my own projects to prevent massive bundle sizes. That works for me. Do what works best for you :)

Re: Ask HN: Am I missing something (modern webdev)?

#3

Post by gompertz » Thu, Nov 24, 2022, 2:57 AM UTC

I'm fairly new myself to web development, but have programmed desktop applications for nearly 20 years, and share your sentiments... I personally found good traction with Dart/Flutter and Svelte. Every other web based framework has felt insanely bulky to me, and I gave many a fair shake.

Re: Ask HN: Am I missing something (modern webdev)?

#4

Post by ushercakes » Thu, Nov 24, 2022, 3:10 AM UTC

There are a lot of very, very successful sites running on vanilla JS, css, and HTML.

Also a lot of pretty simple old school PHP sites that are doing really well.

If you’re working on something at work, it’s best to pick the established frameworks for whatever you’re doing. Easier to get people up to speed, more people to hire with x skill, etc.

Or you may pick a specific thing because it makes the most sense for your specific use case.

Outside of work though, all bets off. I just do what I’m best at, personally. For you, if that’s vanilla JS + html + css, power to ya. You can do a lot with that alone.

Re: Ask HN: Am I missing something (modern webdev)?

#5

Post by matt3210 » Thu, Nov 24, 2022, 3:11 AM UTC

The normie doesn’t want simple, they want fancy

Re: Ask HN: Am I missing something (modern webdev)?

#6

Post by destevil » Thu, Nov 24, 2022, 6:37 AM UTC

I've been writing "web" code since 1995 in all shapes and forms. IMHO, React + Typescript enable well engineered, maintainable code. As the other comments said, you're free pure JS/CSS/HTML as well.

Re: Ask HN: Am I missing something (modern webdev)?

#7

Post by tomcam » Thu, Nov 24, 2022, 8:04 AM UTC

Are you able to support yourself this way? If so then you’re golden and your username checks out.

Re: Ask HN: Am I missing something (modern webdev)?

#8

Post by soueuls » Thu, Nov 24, 2022, 10:55 AM UTC

As projects grow, I am just a lot less productive when I don't have any strong abstractions over the DOM.

Re: Ask HN: Am I missing something (modern webdev)?

#9

Post by hcho » Thu, Nov 24, 2022, 11:10 AM UTC

> What's wrong with building simple web applications that get things done and don't require build tools, secondary (or tertiary) languages or meta-languages (like SCSS, ERB, JSX, Jade, etc)?

Successful projects have a tendency to stop being simple as time goes by. Users start asking for more features, scaling issues crop up, etc, etc.

Re: Ask HN: Am I missing something (modern webdev)?

#10

Post by mac_was » Thu, Nov 24, 2022, 11:28 AM UTC

Do you write Web applications speaking to backends without javascript and using just HTML and CSS or static websites which are improved with animations requiring javascript?