Roger Penrose: “Consciousness must be beyond computable physics”
newscientist.com
Roger Penrose: “Consciousness must be beyond computable physics”
1–10 of 20 posts
Re: Roger Penrose: “Consciousness must be beyond computable physics”
#2This has to be the silliest thing he has promoted, unless he is saying that (e.g.) quantum physics will not end up being computable. Consciousness as implemented relies on cellular processes, some of which necessarily involve quantum phenomena. It is funny to single out consciousness from among myriad other sorts of biological activity and behavior.
Re: Roger Penrose: “Consciousness must be beyond computable physics”
#3But it is computable because we compute it...
Re: Roger Penrose: “Consciousness must be beyond computable physics”
#4This has to be the silliest thing he has promoted, unless he is saying that (e.g.) quantum physics will not end up being computable. Consciousness as implemented relies on cellular processes, some of which necessarily involve quantum phenomena. It is funny to single out consciousness from among myriad other sorts of biological activity and behavior.
It's very silly, and seems like a sad effort to shoehorn dualism back into science. But if the human brain is quantum-magical, kindly point out empirically how its mechanisms are special versus that of any other mammal's brain, or any reptile's, or any nematode worm's.
Quantum mechanics is only involved as much as it is for any other form of chemistry. There is no ghost in any kind of meat.
Re: Roger Penrose: “Consciousness must be beyond computable physics”
#5Trust can be tough when really smart people can get things so wrong
Re: Roger Penrose: “Consciousness must be beyond computable physics”
#6This has to be the silliest thing he has promoted, unless he is saying that (e.g.) quantum physics will not end up being computable. Consciousness as implemented relies on cellular processes, some of which necessarily involve quantum phenomena. It is funny to single out consciousness from among myriad other sorts of biological activity and behavior.
It's very silly, and seems like a sad effort to shoehorn dualism back into science. But if the human brain is quantum-magical, kindly point out empirically how its mechanisms are special versus that of any other mammal's brain, or any reptile's, or any nematode worm's. Quantum mechanics is only involved as much as it is for any other form of chemistry. There is no ghost in any kind of meat.
To be fair, quantum magic could have evolved after the human lineage forked off from the root that includes other mammals.
IE, some magic gene duplication shortly after humans and neaderthals split from their common ancestor, then one copy evolved a slightly different structure that allowed neurons to exploit quantum magic.
This seems implausible, nor would I place the root around the human lineage; might as well assume that all animals, or really anything with a neuron, is capable of this.
Otherwise, we'd be able to isolate the factor (a gene that produces a protein).
Re: Roger Penrose: “Consciousness must be beyond computable physics”
#7This has to be the silliest thing he has promoted, unless he is saying that (e.g.) quantum physics will not end up being computable. Consciousness as implemented relies on cellular processes, some of which necessarily involve quantum phenomena. It is funny to single out consciousness from among myriad other sorts of biological activity and behavior.
It's very silly, and seems like a sad effort to shoehorn dualism back into science. But if the human brain is quantum-magical, kindly point out empirically how its mechanisms are special versus that of any other mammal's brain, or any reptile's, or any nematode worm's. Quantum mechanics is only involved as much as it is for any other form of chemistry. There is no ghost in any kind of meat.
Dualism, yes, but silly -- maybe not. Yes, it's obvious that brains are made up of their chemistry, but this is not (just) about the human brain or even necessarily any brain. We haven't been able to draw a line for consciousness in the spectrum of complexity of life forms.
Re: Roger Penrose: “Consciousness must be beyond computable physics”
#8This has to be the silliest thing he has promoted, unless he is saying that (e.g.) quantum physics will not end up being computable. Consciousness as implemented relies on cellular processes, some of which necessarily involve quantum phenomena. It is funny to single out consciousness from among myriad other sorts of biological activity and behavior.
It's very silly, and seems like a sad effort to shoehorn dualism back into science. But if the human brain is quantum-magical, kindly point out empirically how its mechanisms are special versus that of any other mammal's brain, or any reptile's, or any nematode worm's. Quantum mechanics is only involved as much as it is for any other form of chemistry. There is no ghost in any kind of meat.
Did you even read the article?
Re: Roger Penrose: “Consciousness must be beyond computable physics”
#9My money is on the other end of the spectrum - Any sufficiently large chunk of linear algebra and activation functions is indistinguishable from consciousness. ;)
Re: Roger Penrose: “Consciousness must be beyond computable physics”
#10But it is computable because we compute it...
How are we computing something we can't yet even define?