So, you want to become an Engineering Manager?
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So, you want to become an Engineering Manager?
1–10 of 17 posts
Re: So, you want to become an Engineering Manager?
#2No post body was provided.
Re: So, you want to become an Engineering Manager?
#3Most of that made sense apart from the last paragraph.
Don't most engineering managers get paid more than most IC engineers? Doesn't the move to management progress all the way to the C-suite? If so, then how is moving to management a lateral move?
Re: So, you want to become an Engineering Manager?
#4Most of that made sense apart from the last paragraph. Don't most engineering managers get paid more than most IC engineers? Doesn't the move to management progress all the way to the C-suite? If so, then how is moving to management a lateral move?
In a lot of newer tech companies it's more of a lateral move at the senior level (e.g. SE3 == EM1). I've worked at a few companies now where I've managed engineers who make more than I do.
It's a different set of skills, you're specializing in people vs code. Companies that stack management on top of IC are basically forcing their best engineers to either go into management or leave for a company that doesn't do this.
Re: So, you want to become an Engineering Manager?
#5Most of that made sense apart from the last paragraph. Don't most engineering managers get paid more than most IC engineers? Doesn't the move to management progress all the way to the C-suite? If so, then how is moving to management a lateral move?
In a lot of newer tech companies it's more of a lateral move at the senior level (e.g. SE3 == EM1). I've worked at a few companies now where I've managed engineers who make more than I do. It's a different set of skills, you're specializing in people vs code. Companies that stack management on top of IC are basically forcing their best engineers to either go into management or leave for a company that doesn't do this…
> In a lot of newer tech companies it's more of a lateral move at the senior level
Not really. FAANGs - and few more - have been doing for a time longer than I know of. https://qr.ae/pv58mp
> Companies that stack management on top of IC are basically forcing their best engineers to either go into management or leave for a company that doesn't do this. Again, not really! Amazon does stack rank and they can't afford to force out their best engineers. I'm aware their culture is demanding and that's purpose built, but that does not imply what you are saying. Check their levels here - https://www.levels.fyi/companies/amazon/salaries/software-en...
Re: So, you want to become an Engineering Manager?
#6Earlier quoted context omitted.
In a lot of newer tech companies it's more of a lateral move at the senior level (e.g. SE3 == EM1). I've worked at a few companies now where I've managed engineers who make more than I do. It's a different set of skills, you're specializing in people vs code. Companies that stack management on top of IC are basically forcing their best engineers to either go into management or leave for a company that doesn't do this…
> In a lot of newer tech companies it's more of a lateral move at the senior level Not really. FAANGs - and few more - have been doing for a time longer than I know of. https://qr.ae/pv58mp > Companies that stack management on top of IC are basically forcing their best engineers to either go into management or leave for a company that doesn't do this. Again, not really! Amazon does stack rank and they can't afford to…
Doesn't amazon also have an IC track (with Principal level) and Engineering Managers?
Re: So, you want to become an Engineering Manager?
#7A lot of departments in faang now just have engineering managers and leads, they outsource 90% of the day-to-day dev/grunt work to sub-contractors.
I'm a senior, don't want to be a lead, perhaps this is something for me because I like helping developers but I dislike dealing with stakeholders. Thanks
Re: So, you want to become an Engineering Manager?
#8A lot of departments in faang now just have engineering managers and leads, they outsource 90% of the day-to-day dev/grunt work to sub-contractors. I'm a senior, don't want to be a lead, perhaps this is something for me because I like helping developers but I dislike dealing with stakeholders. Thanks
That's interesting. Any particular company that does this?
Re: So, you want to become an Engineering Manager?
#9A lot of departments in faang now just have engineering managers and leads, they outsource 90% of the day-to-day dev/grunt work to sub-contractors. I'm a senior, don't want to be a lead, perhaps this is something for me because I like helping developers but I dislike dealing with stakeholders. Thanks
That's interesting. Any particular company that does this?
You can see it's quite prevalent:
https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2022-01-20/contra...
In my experience they operate with 100s of external partners. You will find a Faang engineering team with maybe 1-3 internal devs, and 5-10 sub-contracted.
It's a bit frustrating because you're expected to do same level engineering work for maybe 1/2 or 1/3 of the pay.
Re: So, you want to become an Engineering Manager?
#10Earlier quoted context omitted.
That's interesting. Any particular company that does this?
You can see it's quite prevalent: https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2022-01-20/contra... In my experience they operate with 100s of external partners. You will find a Faang engineering team with maybe 1-3 internal devs, and 5-10 sub-contracted. It's a bit frustrating because you're expected to do same level engineering work for maybe 1/2 or 1/3 of the pay.
That's not about SW devs, more about data entry / dataset labeling / "turkers".
I did saw something that you described long time ago at a multinational company, where the employees were mostly managers and team leads, and most devs were contractors. But they gradually moved to a model were they have R&D centers in a lower cost regions were the developers are hired as local employees.
Advantages of hiring SW devs/engineers as contractors at big public companies:
1. they can be hired and fired with the short notice (elasticity)
2. the HR process is less scrupulous and/or bureaucratic (since it's not a permanent position)
3. usually contractors are still can be hired, even when there is a freeze on hiring new employees
4. it can be treated as a trial period for potential new employees
5. most contractors (i.e. those hired via agency, not self-employed) see employee status as a coveted promotion
6. public companies don't count contractors as employees but as service providers, so Revenue-per-employee / Profit-per-employee will be much higher