MiSTer, an open-source FPGA gaming project
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Re: MiSTer, an open-source FPGA gaming project
#2This isn't really new, right? I've heard of this years ago.
But it is an amazing project. Instead of emulating, they actually rebuilt the old custom ICs (which 8-bit computers were full of) in an FPGA. Really impressive.
Re: MiSTer, an open-source FPGA gaming project
#3This isn't really new, right? I've heard of this years ago. But it is an amazing project. Instead of emulating, they actually rebuilt the old custom ICs (which 8-bit computers were full of) in an FPGA. Really impressive.
Old projects get reshared many times. It's always new to someone.
Re: MiSTer, an open-source FPGA gaming project
#4This isn't really new, right? I've heard of this years ago. But it is an amazing project. Instead of emulating, they actually rebuilt the old custom ICs (which 8-bit computers were full of) in an FPGA. Really impressive.
Yeah, it really is an amazing application for FPGAs—preserving computing and gaming history.
The list of cores available for MiSTer is simply staggering:
> Computers - Classic
• Acorn Archimedes • Acorn Atom • Alice MC10 • Altair 8800 • Amiga • Amstrad CPC 6128 • Amstrad PCW • ao486 (PC 486) • Apogee • Apple I • Apple II+ • Apple Macintosh Plus • Aquarius • Atari 800XL • Atari ST/STe • BBC Micro B,Master • BK0011M • Color Computer 2, Dragon 32 • Commodore 16, Plus/4 • Commodore 64, Ultimax • Commodore PET • Commodore VIC-20 • DEC PDP-1 • EDSAC • Galaksija • Jupiter Ace • Laser 310 • MSX • MultiComp • Orao • Oric 1 & Atmos • SAM Coupe • Sharp MZ Series • Sinclair QL • Specialist/MX • TI-99/4A • TRS-80 Model 1 • TSConf • Vector 06C • X68000 • ZX Spectrum • ZX Spectrum Next • ZX81
> Consoles - Classic
• Astrocade • Atari 2600 • Atari 5200 • Atari Lynx • AY-3-8500 • ColecoVision, SG-1000 • Gameboy, Gameboy Color • Gameboy Advance • Genesis/Megadrive • SMS, Game Gear • MegaCD • NeoGeo • NES • Odyssey2 • SNES • TurboGrafx 16 / PC Engine • Vectrex
> Other Systems
• Arduboy • Chess • CHIP-8 • Epoch Galaxy II • Flappy Bird • Game of Life • TomyTronic Scramble
Re: MiSTer, an open-source FPGA gaming project
#5I don’t really know much about game emulation so I was curious about what differentiates this FPGA game project vs traditional CPU emulation.
From their github page [1]:
>Traditional emulators on CPUs execute code sequentially. This is a tricky method of emulation because real hardware has many chips and all of them work in parallel...This requires a lot of CPU power to emulate even an old and slow retro computer. Sometimes even a modern CPU working at 100 times the speed of the retro computer is not enough, so the emulator has to use approximation, skip emulation of some less important parts, or assume some standard work of the emulated system without extraordinary usage.
> FPGA doesn't need high frequencies to emulate retro computers; it works at much lower frequencies than traditional emulators require. Since everything in FPGA works in parallel, it is no problem to handle any possible usage of the emulated system.
[1] https://github.com/MiSTer-devel/Main_MiSTer/wiki/Why-FPGA
(Edited for formatting)
Re: MiSTer, an open-source FPGA gaming project
#6This isn't really new, right? I've heard of this years ago. But it is an amazing project. Instead of emulating, they actually rebuilt the old custom ICs (which 8-bit computers were full of) in an FPGA. Really impressive.
It is indeed an amazing project, especially its open source nature. It provides some impressive power savings and latency reductions that are very hard to match with general purpose CPUs.
But in most cases, it is emulation, as the lead developer will attest.
https://github.com/MiSTer-devel/Main_MiSTer/wiki/Why-FPGA
"From my point of view, if the FPGA code is based on the circuitry of real hardware (along with the usual tweaks for FPGA compatibility), then it should be called replication. Anything else is emulation, since it uses different kinds of approximation to meet the same objectives. Currently, it's hard to find a core that can truly be called a replica – most cores are based on more-or-less functional recreations rather than true circuit recreation. The most widely used CPU cores – the Z80 (T80) and MC68000 (TG68K) – are pure functional emulations, not replications. So it's okay to call FPGA cores emulators, unless they are proven to be replicas."
But there's nothing wrong with emulation for preservation, until we get to a point where we can wide-scale clone these older chips down to the transistor level through analysis of delayered decap scans. And even then, emulation will be useful for artificial enhancements as well as for understanding how all those transistors actually worked at a higher level.
It's also not a total solution: by taking many more transistors to programmatically simulate just one, it limits the maximum scale and frequency of what it can support. N64/PS1/Saturn has not yet been fully supported and is still theoretical, but likely, to be possible. Going beyond that is not possible at this time.
Software emulation and FPGA devices should be seen as complementary approaches, rather than competitive. The developers of each often work together, and new knowledge is mutually beneficial.
Re: MiSTer, an open-source FPGA gaming project
#7I'd really like to see a portable/handheld leverage this technology for on-the-go gaming.
Re: MiSTer, an open-source FPGA gaming project
#8I'd really like to see a portable/handheld leverage this technology for on-the-go gaming.
The Analogue Pocket[1] is exactly this (albeit proprietary). Out of the box it recreates GB, GBC, and GBA using the Altera Cyclone-V platform.
Re: MiSTer, an open-source FPGA gaming project
#9This isn't really new, right? I've heard of this years ago. But it is an amazing project. Instead of emulating, they actually rebuilt the old custom ICs (which 8-bit computers were full of) in an FPGA. Really impressive.
Yeah, it really is an amazing application for FPGAs—preserving computing and gaming history. The list of cores available for MiSTer is simply staggering: > Computers - Classic • Acorn Archimedes • Acorn Atom • Alice MC10 • Altair 8800 • Amiga • Amstrad CPC 6128 • Amstrad PCW • ao486 (PC 486) • Apogee • Apple I • Apple II+ • Apple Macintosh Plus • Aquarius • Atari 800XL • Atari ST/STe • BBC Micro B,Master • BK0011M •…
I'm still waiting for the KENBAK-1 core.
Re: MiSTer, an open-source FPGA gaming project
#10I love my MiSTer build!
The usb controllers made for the recent mini systems (NES, SNES, Genesis, etc) make great accessories for the mister. Add a couple of usb arcade sticks and you can really play almost any classic retro games as it was meant to be played.
And then there are all the classic computer cores even including the PDP-1!