US, Europe 'unrealistic' in fab expansion drive, says TSMC chair
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Re: US, Europe 'unrealistic' in fab expansion drive, says TSMC chair
#2Sounds like someone wants to hold onto unsustainable monopoly.
Edit: chip shortage has been a known variable for over a year now. I think TSM overplayed its hands a bit. They didn’t want to expand and get caught when the demand would subside, which is very understandable. But what they didn’t foresee is that the US govt would get involved in propping up its competition in direct response.
Re: US, Europe 'unrealistic' in fab expansion drive, says TSMC chair
#3Doesn't this imply that it would be unrealistic to create large amounts of new supply to satisfy local strategic needs in a global economy?
for a large market like the US/Europe couldn't they choose to not participate in the global market for chips? or tip the scales such that local competitors are favored?
I don't see any reason why certain products couldn't be on a sliding tariff scale dependent on how much is imported. 20-40% imports = no tariffs, 80% triggers a sliding tariff scale. This would allow for strategic preservation and global competition. Once you fully outsource an industry it's hard for it to ever grow back - even if it makes sense for it too.
Re: US, Europe 'unrealistic' in fab expansion drive, says TSMC chair
#4What is the distribution of education-level of workers at a typical fab? Is it like 90% researchers, or more like 90% production workers?
Re: US, Europe 'unrealistic' in fab expansion drive, says TSMC chair
#5It would be nice if they reported on the reasons given in support of the claims instead of just the claims on their own.
Re: US, Europe 'unrealistic' in fab expansion drive, says TSMC chair
#6Doesn't this imply that it would be unrealistic to create large amounts of new supply to satisfy local strategic needs in a global economy? for a large market like the US/Europe couldn't they choose to not participate in the global market for chips? or tip the scales such that local competitors are favored? I don't see any reason why certain products couldn't be on a sliding tariff scale dependent on how much is impo…
Unrealistic given how much fab facotiries cost.
Your tariff method would work for say mining copper or say iron screws but not for a fab factory as it can't really be scaled halfway
Re: US, Europe 'unrealistic' in fab expansion drive, says TSMC chair
#7Doesn't this imply that it would be unrealistic to create large amounts of new supply to satisfy local strategic needs in a global economy? for a large market like the US/Europe couldn't they choose to not participate in the global market for chips? or tip the scales such that local competitors are favored? I don't see any reason why certain products couldn't be on a sliding tariff scale dependent on how much is impo…
The question of unprofitability is interesting on large capital projects - it's often a question of what timescale we're talking about, and if nations become involved then the timescales can be both significantly larger as well as the dynamics of possibly loaned or direct grant money for the capital.
If it's a matter of subsidizing one industry to favor the overall economy (e.g. more chips so the automotive and other sectors don't slow down), then nations also get involved. China pretty much directly and openly, and the US/Europe more indirectly.
Re: US, Europe 'unrealistic' in fab expansion drive, says TSMC chair
#8Is Liu misunderstanding the Western plans or am I? I was under the impression that the US and Europe intended to get some onshore fab capacity as a second-source and backup in case Taiwan is blockaded or worse.
If the plan was to replace TSMC entirely, well, I'd think he was justifiably concerned as (a) a threat to his business and (b) evidence that the US was decoupling from Taiwan. But I don't think that's the case.
Re: US, Europe 'unrealistic' in fab expansion drive, says TSMC chair
#9It may be true that TSMC and Samsung can meet demand during normal times, but it completely misses the point that NA and EU want significant production capacity locally not to reduce costs, but to secure a critical supply chain.
Is this a situation where he may be concerned that significant expansion of production capability away from Taiwan and SK will reduce the West’s reliance on TSMC, which may be a security risk for TSMC or Taiwan? I’m nowhere near an expert on this sort of thing, I’m honestly curious.
Re: US, Europe 'unrealistic' in fab expansion drive, says TSMC chair
#10Doesn't this imply that it would be unrealistic to create large amounts of new supply to satisfy local strategic needs in a global economy? for a large market like the US/Europe couldn't they choose to not participate in the global market for chips? or tip the scales such that local competitors are favored? I don't see any reason why certain products couldn't be on a sliding tariff scale dependent on how much is impo…
Unrealistic given how much fab facotiries cost. Your tariff method would work for say mining copper or say iron screws but not for a fab factory as it can't really be scaled halfway
What's the US military budget? Let's say DOD decides it wants onshore chips. $10B is peanuts; $100B is easily doable if they say it's important enough- which it is.