EU: "Making hacking tools should be illegal"

The fun thing about it: the german cia equivalent "BND" lets german developers develop hacking tools via ssh or rdp on boxes that sit in other countries to circumvent that law.

I'll provide a link as soon as i find a source other than one of the hackers i know.

Re: EU: "Making hacking tools should be illegal"

#5

Post by jvanenk » Tue, Jun 14, 2011, 7:45 PM UTC

These sorts of laws need to include exceptions for tools that have a non-criminal purpose. Otherwise, a broad reading could include things like NetCat, Curl, and Apache Bench.

Re: EU: "Making hacking tools should be illegal"

#6

Post by Isamu » Tue, Jun 14, 2011, 7:46 PM UTC

Laws with unintended consequences should be illegal.

Re: EU: "Making hacking tools should be illegal"

#7

Post by randombit » Tue, Jun 14, 2011, 7:50 PM UTC

dmc wrote: post #2

The full statement is available here[1]. [1] - http://www.consilium.europa.eu/uedocs/cms_data/docs/pressdat...

The actual directive seems to be 14436/10 which is available here - http://register.consilium.europa.eu/pdf/en/10/st14/st14436.e...

The relevant portion is Article 7

""" Member States shall take the necessary measure to ensure that the production, sale, procurement for use, import, possession, distribution or otherwise making available of the following is punishable as a criminal offence when committed intentionally and without right for the purpose of committing any of the offences referred to in Articles 3 to 6:

(a) device, including a computer program, designed or adapted primarily for the purpose of committing any of the offences referred to in Articles 3 to 6;

(b) a computer password, access code, or similar data by which the whole or any part of an information system is capable of being accessed. """

Which seems to be saying that, say, nmap isn't illegal, unless you download it with the intent to run it against a machine you're not supposed to, in which case you've broken the law (even if you never actually use it). Kind of like laws against 'burglary tools' in some parts of the US, the crime seems to be based on context/intent.

(Obvious disclaimer about how I'm not a lawyer, European, or a unicorn.)

Re: EU: "Making hacking tools should be illegal"

#8

Post by zoowar » Tue, Jun 14, 2011, 7:50 PM UTC

Your hacking tool is my security analysis tool.

Re: EU: "Making hacking tools should be illegal"

#9

Post by mrcharles » Tue, Jun 14, 2011, 7:51 PM UTC

This seems more like one of those ideas which end up being a law used to slap people a second time when they are nabbed for something rather than something that would be enforced on its own.

Re: EU: "Making hacking tools should be illegal"

#10

Post by bellaire » Tue, Jun 14, 2011, 7:56 PM UTC

The linked PDF is ambiguous, "penalisation of the production and making available of tools ... for committing the offences".

If this requires mens rea, i.e. they prove that your intent was for committing an offense, it's not such a big deal.

If it does not, i.e. your software merely could possibly be used to commit an offense, it's a huge deal.