The degrowth movement wants to intentionally shrink the economy
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Re: The degrowth movement wants to intentionally shrink the economy
#2Would be great, but human nature is to want more stuff, money and power.
On the upside, many "new" sectors don't use natural resources, except human time. E.g. writing blog posts, social media management, doing marketing campaigns for Gucci. Growth in those sectors should be (mostly) easy on the planet.
Re: The degrowth movement wants to intentionally shrink the economy
#3Would be great, but human nature is to want more stuff, money and power. On the upside, many "new" sectors don't use natural resources, except human time. E.g. writing blog posts, social media management, doing marketing campaigns for Gucci. Growth in those sectors should be (mostly) easy on the planet.
Except aren't a lot the jobs you described usually trying to sell products that aren't necessarily good for the planet?
Re: The degrowth movement wants to intentionally shrink the economy
#4>After a reduction in material and energy consumption, which will constrict the economy, there should also be a redistribution of existing wealth, and a transition from a materialistic society to one in which the values are based on simpler lifestyles and unpaid work and activities.
So, this movement is communism by another name? I understand that the new bit is the reduction energy consumption and quality of life, but it seems to me that they first need to get to the communist stage and then they'll shrink the economy. In other words: it's a fantasy.
Re: The degrowth movement wants to intentionally shrink the economy
#5"Practically, this would also require an increase in free public services; people won’t have to make as much money if they don’t have to spend on healthcare, housing, education, and transportation. Some degrowthers also call for a universal income to compensate for a shorter work week."
How about we just give every person a billion dollars? Then no one would have to work, and they could invest their excess cash in the environment. Jesus guys, why don't you put me in charge?
Re: The degrowth movement wants to intentionally shrink the economy
#6Would be great, but human nature is to want more stuff, money and power. On the upside, many "new" sectors don't use natural resources, except human time. E.g. writing blog posts, social media management, doing marketing campaigns for Gucci. Growth in those sectors should be (mostly) easy on the planet.
Except aren't a lot the jobs you described usually trying to sell products that aren't necessarily good for the planet?
Exactly this. Without stuff to sell, those "industries" wouldn't really exist. If your blog relies on ad revenue and you have nothing to advertise you're not making money. Gucci doesn't need to advertise if there's no competition to Gucci.
Re: The degrowth movement wants to intentionally shrink the economy
#7What size ‘should’ the global economy be?
Re: The degrowth movement wants to intentionally shrink the economy
#8What's stopping them? There's tons of empty land in the world. Go find a stream in the forest and live a sustenance-level life. Oh, they want everyone else to be miserable too.
Re: The degrowth movement wants to intentionally shrink the economy
#9Would be great, but human nature is to want more stuff, money and power. On the upside, many "new" sectors don't use natural resources, except human time. E.g. writing blog posts, social media management, doing marketing campaigns for Gucci. Growth in those sectors should be (mostly) easy on the planet.
> Would be great, but human nature is to want more stuff, money and power.
A lot of HN lives in an upper-middle class first world bubble. Median global income is $2900 per year. That's less than $10 a day.
For the vast majority of the world, economic growth isn't about "stuff, money and power". It's about escaping abject poverty. It's about reliable access to running water, electricity, shelter, and food.
Re: The degrowth movement wants to intentionally shrink the economy
#10An author once came and spoke to my environmental studies class. Of the Club of Rome, he said "Fascinating ideas. They might be right. But try getting elected by promising a shrinking economy."
Yeah, not gonna happen. Best to treat growth as a given and work around it, imho.