First physiological test for autism proves high accuracy in second trial
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Re: First physiological test for autism proves high accuracy in second trial
#2Perhaps I missed it, but I did not see anything about controlling for the potential effects of those persons with ASD having taken drugs to mitigate symptoms. Couldn't the biochemical effects of ASD drugs themselves be the primary indicating factor? I've seen studies on biochemical indicators for schizophrenia also make this same mistake.
Re: First physiological test for autism proves high accuracy in second trial
#3Perhaps I missed it, but I did not see anything about controlling for the potential effects of those persons with ASD having taken drugs to mitigate symptoms. Couldn't the biochemical effects of ASD drugs themselves be the primary indicating factor? I've seen studies on biochemical indicators for schizophrenia also make this same mistake.
No, read the source article.
The validation data are taken at baseline from three previously published studies investigating pharmaceutical interventions to normalize metabolic abnormalities of children with ASD31: (1) a combination of methylcobalamin and low dose folinic acid32, 33 (2) high dose folinic acid,34 and (3) sapropternin.35 Given that these studies all focused on evaluating treatment strategies for ASD, all participants had a confirmed diagnosis of ASD. FOCM/TS metabolites were available for 154 (76% male) participants with ASD with a mean age of 8.8 years (range 2–17 years). These ages are different than reported by Delhey et al.34 because this study only required that measurements be available at baseline, rather than both at baseline as well as the conclusion of the treatment phase. Furthermore, stratifying patients by age or gender did not reveal any differences in the univariate metabolite distributions. The first two studies were approved by the IRB at the University of Arkansas for Medical Sciences and the third study was approved by the IRB at the University of Texas Health Science Center at Houston. All parents gave written, signed consent and patients provided assent when appropriate.
2.3 Metabolites
The metabolites under investigation are presented in Table 1 and additional details of these measurements and derivations are presented in Melnyk, et al.30 This is only a subset of the measurements investigated previously29 because “% DNA methylation” and “8‐OHG” were absent from the validation data set and were therefore removed from this study to ensure that a consistent set of metabolites are used for training and testing.
(Table 1 - 22 metabolic variables considered)
https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1002/btm2.10095
I’m curious if these metabolic abnormalities apply to adults as well. I had an ADOS at the UCD MIND Institute come back with a 7 (1-14 scale IIRC) about 10 years ago.
PS: PKU treatment sapropterin (Kuvan) costs $100k USD/yr
Re: First physiological test for autism proves high accuracy in second trial
#4Very surprising result. I don't think I've ever heard of a blood test for a mental disorder -- at least, not one that actually works.
Re: First physiological test for autism proves high accuracy in second trial
#5Very surprising result. I don't think I've ever heard of a blood test for a mental disorder -- at least, not one that actually works.
Be careful about that kind of wording. I and friends who're on the spectrum don't consider it a "mental disorder". It's simply a physiological difference, one that theoretically can be tested for.
Re: First physiological test for autism proves high accuracy in second trial
#6Very surprising result. I don't think I've ever heard of a blood test for a mental disorder -- at least, not one that actually works.
Be careful about that kind of wording. I and friends who're on the spectrum don't consider it a "mental disorder". It's simply a physiological difference, one that theoretically can be tested for.
Doesn't that reasoning apply to any disorder? Medically, a disorder is simply "a disruption of normal physical or mental functions." So, having any disorder makes one abnormal, unique, special, and possibly above average or below average, but certainly not average.
"Disorder" and "special physiological difference" are synonyms.
Re: First physiological test for autism proves high accuracy in second trial
#7Very surprising result. I don't think I've ever heard of a blood test for a mental disorder -- at least, not one that actually works.
Be careful about that kind of wording. I and friends who're on the spectrum don't consider it a "mental disorder". It's simply a physiological difference, one that theoretically can be tested for.
I hear you but the DSM-5 (Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders) classifies it as a mental disorder.
Autism Spectrum Disorder 299.00 (F84.0)
Re: First physiological test for autism proves high accuracy in second trial
#8Very surprising result. I don't think I've ever heard of a blood test for a mental disorder -- at least, not one that actually works.
> I don't think I've ever heard of a blood test for a mental disorder
Autism, and all the other pseudo-mental disorders, have always had underlying physiological considerations. It is a mistake to treat people with these diagnoses as having a 'chronic' condition that can't be cured.
For example, cortisol deficiency has been associated with psychosis [0] since the 1950's [1], but the mental health industry has been treating this condition with awful palliative drugs since they were approved by the FDA (also in the 1950's).
Traditionally the diagnosis of autism has been based on an assessment of symptoms. It was assumed that the symptoms are related to the child having inherited "bad genes". There is no cure for "bad genes", so palliative therapy was thought appropriate. This study basically confirms that Autism has metabolic considerations, which can be addressed with appropriate interventions.
[0] https://psychcentral.com/news/2016/06/04/low-morning-cortiso...
[1] https://www.esquire.com/news-politics/a12775932/sackler-fami...
Re: First physiological test for autism proves high accuracy in second trial
#9Very surprising result. I don't think I've ever heard of a blood test for a mental disorder -- at least, not one that actually works.
Be careful about that kind of wording. I and friends who're on the spectrum don't consider it a "mental disorder". It's simply a physiological difference, one that theoretically can be tested for.
> Be careful about that kind of wording
I have friends on the spectrum. I happen to agree that mildly autistic behaviour is more akin to a personality difference than a disorder.
That said, I don't think it's fair to admonish someone for using the colloquial norm. The comment might read better if stated less as "careful, you're doing something wrong" and more in the tone of "here is another viewpoint you may find helpful and interesting."
Re: First physiological test for autism proves high accuracy in second trial
#10Earlier quoted context omitted.
Be careful about that kind of wording. I and friends who're on the spectrum don't consider it a "mental disorder". It's simply a physiological difference, one that theoretically can be tested for.
I hear you but the DSM-5 (Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders) classifies it as a mental disorder. Autism Spectrum Disorder 299.00 (F84.0)
I wouldn't use this as a supporting argument. Didn't DSM-3 classify homosexuality as a disorder?