How do you make programmers work 60-80 hours per week?
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Re: How do you make programmers work 60-80 hours per week?
#2Brain Knapp is so on the money here.
So, if attendance is your key metric the best way to get them to attend 60-80 hours a week is pay them by the hour, plus allow them to "work from home" half the time.
Re: How do you make programmers work 60-80 hours per week?
#3My first programming job (actually, just my first job) was technically a 40 hour/week job, but in the employee handbook it said something along the lines of: "The day is typically regarded as 8AM to 8PM." They didn't pay very well either. Brian is right, I totally hated my job, hated my boss, hated pretty much the entire company, and quit in 5 months. I was pretty disappointed. I'm still cautious about getting back into the industry. I'm at school now, not studying anything CS related.
Re: How do you make programmers work 60-80 hours per week?
#4This sounds true to me, but it would take a very uncommon executive to put it into practice. MBA types won't do a thing without quantitative data behind it and attempts to measure real productivity in creative fields usually turn into meaningless self-fulfilling prophecies. I wonder what it would take to break the dogma of the 40-hour week?
Re: How do you make programmers work 60-80 hours per week?
#5This sounds true to me, but it would take a very uncommon executive to put it into practice. MBA types won't do a thing without quantitative data behind it and attempts to measure real productivity in creative fields usually turn into meaningless self-fulfilling prophecies. I wonder what it would take to break the dogma of the 40-hour week?
Running teams of contractors for years, I disagree it's uncommon. I let my guys do whatever they want as long as the work is being delivered.
Sometimes I have to have a standoff with some salaried dragonwoman or other who takes offence but that's on me and doesn't run downstream -- as long as everything is being done why should this be a problem?
Productivity drops when you force people to work outside their peak schedule and as soon as you force school rules you immediately deteriorate your relationship with a subordinate because you're saying you don't trust them from the outset.
Someone takes the piss then reign them in. Starting from that position makes you a bad boss and an unhappy team is much less likely to scrape across the finish line each sprint than one who isn't...
Re: How do you make programmers work 60-80 hours per week?
#6This sounds true to me, but it would take a very uncommon executive to put it into practice. MBA types won't do a thing without quantitative data behind it and attempts to measure real productivity in creative fields usually turn into meaningless self-fulfilling prophecies. I wonder what it would take to break the dogma of the 40-hour week?
Running teams of contractors for years, I disagree it's uncommon. I let my guys do whatever they want as long as the work is being delivered. Sometimes I have to have a standoff with some salaried dragonwoman or other who takes offence but that's on me and doesn't run downstream -- as long as everything is being done why should this be a problem? Productivity drops when you force people to work outside their peak sch…
> Running teams of contractors for years, I disagree it's uncommon. I let my guys do whatever they want as long as the work is being delivered.
I agree with this statement. I would amend it to say "As long as the work they signed up for is being delivered."
Re: How do you make programmers work 60-80 hours per week?
#7To answer the actual question:
1. Pay your programmers per hour, and pay them very well. For example many people who are paid $200/hour would work 80 hours per week.
2. Provide free taxis or have easy public transportation to their homes.
3. Offer to pay for their children's daycare if they work extra hours.
4. Provide free food delivery from nearby restaurants.
Re: How do you make programmers work 60-80 hours per week?
#8I think it follows from Brian's point that only founders may ever put in that much work, maybe very early employees; as he said, the trick is to be painting your own house...
Having said that, I completely agree that long hours are overrated and maybe unhealthy. Burnout will follow. Everyone has to recover. Such long stints can only be kept up for so long!
Re: How do you make programmers work 60-80 hours per week?
#9To answer the actual question: 1. Pay your programmers per hour, and pay them very well. For example many people who are paid $200/hour would work 80 hours per week. 2. Provide free taxis or have easy public transportation to their homes. 3. Offer to pay for their children's daycare if they work extra hours. 4. Provide free food delivery from nearby restaurants.
Why would you work 80 hours per week when a couple of hours a day is enough to get by? Or even encourage that? There's plenty more important things in life than work and funny money, and plenty more important things in work than number of hours spent behind the keyboard.
Re: How do you make programmers work 60-80 hours per week?
#10My first programming job (actually, just my first job) was technically a 40 hour/week job, but in the employee handbook it said something along the lines of: "The day is typically regarded as 8AM to 8PM." They didn't pay very well either. Brian is right, I totally hated my job, hated my boss, hated pretty much the entire company, and quit in 5 months. I was pretty disappointed. I'm still cautious about getting back i…
> "The day is typically regarded as 8AM to 8PM."
Did the building have nets under the windows?