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US and Iran agree to provisional ceasefire

theguardian.com

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Re: US and Iran agree to provisional ceasefire

#991

Post by a_ba »

breppp wrote: post #893
selfmodruntime wrote: post #822

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Congratulations, Iran has won the ability to fund its politics many times over in this way and they've lost little else.

Their entire leadership, navy, airforce, petrochemical and steel industries as well as the entire supply chain for the ballistic and drones industries which is also a lucrative export to Russia. I am not sure they "lost a little else". When looking at what the US lost, it's pretty small in comparison

Russia and China would likely disagree as they count their gains: - yet another massive blow to their trust and reputation among allies - again massively undermining NATO thereby fostering global instability - weakened credibility vis a vis defending Taiwan

Re: US and Iran agree to provisional ceasefire

#992

Post by bdbdbdb »

torginus wrote: post #937
Aloisius wrote: post #260

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Iran's semi-official Mehr News Agency (via China's state news agency Xinhua[0]) claims the 10 points are: 1. U.S. commitment to ensure no further acts of aggression 2. Continued Iranian control of the Strait of Hormuz 3. Acceptance of Iran's nuclear enrichment rights 4. Lifting of all primary sanctions 5. Lifting of all secondary sanctions 6. Termination of all United Nations Security Council resolutions against Iran…

The whole concept of the ceasefire is absurd - it's like the joke that to combat the rise of suicides, the government made them punishable by death. There's no enforcement mechanism, only big dog, small dog logic. What happens if one party breaks the ceasefire? The other starts shooting ?

Well we've already found out because Israel broke it. With Gaza they've gotten used to very flexible ceasefires where you can still bomb the other side repeatedly and the ceasefire "holds". Iran has shown that this will not work with them, and they closed the strait again

Re: US and Iran agree to provisional ceasefire

#993

Post by aucisson_masque »

surgical_fire wrote: post #798
aucisson_masque wrote: post #789

I can't figure out what was even USA goal in this war ? they have said everything and it's contrary, so there is no way to know if they won or if they lost. I guess it's a smart move. But on the other hand, Iran still has enriched uranium, nuclear facilities and now they even have put in the agreement a recognition of Iran's right to seek nuclear technology. Iran missiles.. they still shoot them and there is nothing…

> Iran government has not been replaced. I'd say it's even stronger now that it 'won' the war (that's the way they're going to show it on national television) and they even asked to get UN sanctions lifted. That will bring them some legitimacy back. That's the thing, winning depends on your goals. Iran's goal was to survive as a country, and the autocratic theocracy that rules it to stay in charge. Not only it manage…

Yeah, on second thought I think that the real winner is Israel.

After all, it's their war. American shouldn't even care and yet they got convinced to spend billions and billions on this war that will benefit mostly Israel.

And the greatest achievement ? Before you mention it in the comment, I even had forgotten that Israel was cobeligirent in that war. They go under the radar when they are those who actually reached their goal: kill, murder Iran official, destroy their infrastructures, 'lay down the grass' as they say.

And now they even invaded Lebanon while the world is happy because the Detroit is open again.

Truly a masterclass.

Re: US and Iran agree to provisional ceasefire

#994

Post by da-x »

joejohnson wrote: post #871
megamike wrote: post #31

Iran's 10-point plan includes: 1. Guarantee that Iran will not be attacked again 2. Permanent end to the war, not just a ceasefire 3. End to Israeli strikes in Lebanon 4. Lifting of all US sanctions on Iran 5. End to all regional fighting against Iranian allies 6. In return, Iran would open the Strait of Hormuz 7. Iran would impose a Hormuz fee of $2 million per ship 8. Iran would split these fees with Oman 9. Iran t…

Sadly they have dropped requirements that Netanyahu be turned over to the ICC, but it's important to recognize that this ceasefire is between Iran and the US only and not necessarily a deal between Iran and Israel. >> 1. Guarantee that Iran will not be attacked again Hard for the Iranians to take anything the US says seriously. US launched attacks in the middle of the last two negotiations.

Yeah, it would be ridiculous that the IRGC terrorist regime, which fired super-inexact ballistic missiles that split to cluster bombs that spread in 70 parts on a 3 miles radius in residential areas, for a whole month, on a daily basis, would ask that someone _else_ will be held go to the ICC tribunal...

Re: US and Iran agree to provisional ceasefire

#996

Post by surgical_fire »

aucisson_masque wrote: post #993
surgical_fire wrote: post #798

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Iran government has not been replaced. I'd say it's even stronger now that it 'won' the war (that's the way they're going to show it on national television) and they even asked to get UN sanctions lifted. That will bring them some legitimacy back. That's the thing, winning depends on your goals. Iran's goal was to survive as a country, and the autocratic theocracy that rules it to stay in charge. Not only it manage…

Yeah, on second thought I think that the real winner is Israel. After all, it's their war. American shouldn't even care and yet they got convinced to spend billions and billions on this war that will benefit mostly Israel. And the greatest achievement ? Before you mention it in the comment, I even had forgotten that Israel was cobeligirent in that war. They go under the radar when they are those who actually reached…

Exactly. People always focus on discussing whether the US is succeeding or failing, whether Iran will control the strait or not, and they forget that Israel is an active party there.

Meanwhile they are also invading Lebanon, and never abandoned the genocide against Palestinians. That "final solution" is still ongoing, but completely fell of the radar.

Re: US and Iran agree to provisional ceasefire

#997

Post by intensifier »

helo4362 wrote: post #328

Why does india support iran while enemies to Palestine. Is it because of shia vs sunni sects

India supported Israel until Iran started to look like winning. Modi visited Israel right the day before Israel strike on Iran leading to this war. They never thought Iran could fight USA.

Re: US and Iran agree to provisional ceasefire

#998

Post by firetruck »

peder wrote: post #407
zild3d wrote: post #395

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Iran's 10-point plan (that no one else has agreed to)

Exactly, but Hacker News is upvoting this because it wants the US to be seen as the loser of this conflict. Both sides in a conflict (or any negotiation) make demands that they know the other will not accept. You can't just take someone's list like that and assume that'll be the exact outcome.

hackers are often leftwing sweaty tryhards, obviously not all of them ;) but whatever, let them suck on those circumsized penis while the local paki rape gangs rule the streets of europe.

Re: US and Iran agree to provisional ceasefire

#1000

Post by alsetmusic »

alsetmusic wrote: post #581
ekr wrote: post #563

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you're mostly right, except maybe a bit misinformed on #1. The younger Khamenei is, according to recent reports, in a very unstable condition, has likely never actually had an input on the leadership of Iran so far, and his future state is uncertain. So I think there will be another leader elected soon.

> I think you're mostly right, except maybe a bit misinformed on #1. The younger Khamenei is, according to recent reports, in a very unstable condition, has likely never actually had an input on the leadership of Iran so far, and his future state is uncertain. > So I think there will be another leader elected soon. What does that have to do with anything? The USA (my country, sadly) provoked a far smaller nation and…

What the eff do you even mean? I'm not trying to be inquisitive. I'm pointing out a very specific fault. You're trying to reframe my point and you're full of it.

> What does that have to do with anything?

That's not an actual question. That's me saying "wtf are you talking about".

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