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The elderly are becoming homeless at a rate not seen since the Great Depression

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Re: The elderly are becoming homeless at a rate not seen since the Great Depression

#991

Post by fzeroracer »

AnthonyMouse wrote: post #989
fzeroracer wrote: post #987

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It makes them money because if you pay attention, apartment prices almost never fall nowadays. They always gradually go up. In a market where supply is constantly being added to meet demand, you would expect costs to go down in cities where people are leaving. For example, NYC's population has remained relatively static or even gone down, but the rent prices sharply go up, far more than inflation. Keep in mind the ma…

> In a market where supply is constantly being added to meet demand, you would expect costs to go down in cities where people are leaving. Sufficient supply is not being added to meet demand -- that's why prices keep going up. > For example, NYC's population has remained relatively static or even gone down, but the rent prices sharply go up, far more than inflation. NYC's population grows by about 0.3% every year: ht…

It has nothing to do with inept laws. It has everything to do with the corrupt behavior of often large companies that own all of these rental units.

Like I get the feeling you don't rent. When I was living in Austin, my apartment rent shot up over 30%, in an area on the outskirts of Austin near nothing. It's nice to think that this problem could be solved by simply dumping supply on the market, but even in areas where that's being done or where there isn't significant demand rent is skyrocketing. And even when supply is dropped, it's bought up by said large corporations and investment groups that price fix it anyways.

It's occurring throughout the entire US regardless of local laws, though some areas are gouged even further. We know large landlords collude on this sort of thing to the point there's an actual term for it called warehousing [1]

[1] https://www.fox5ny.com/news/nyc-warehousing-empty-apartments

Re: The elderly are becoming homeless at a rate not seen since the Great Depression

#992

Post by BirAdam »

flagrant_taco wrote: post #913
BirAdam wrote: post #737

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do not disagree with your first part. The second part, I would argue has been proven false. Voting changes nothing, and I dare say that were voting capable of changing anything, it'd be illegal. Obama and Trump both said they were antiwar and would end war, neither did. All of the Presidents of my life time have spoken against large deficit spending except for Clinton and Biden, and hilariously, only Clinton ever m…

Oh we're 100% on the same page. I whole heartedly believe the ideals behind democracy are meant to keep power in check, but we lost that before I was born. I'd argue that I've never truly lived in a democracy, but I hope to one day. It's a system I would fight for if there were actually a semblance of a movement willing to stand up and say enough is enough. So far though I've been a bit sad, or maybe just disappointe…

Most people only “believe” in democracy when they’re on the winning side of an election. Later, when the elected individual doesn’t live up to his/her campaign promises everyone seems to have amnesia and they go right back to the polls.

Re: The elderly are becoming homeless at a rate not seen since the Great Depression

#993

Post by BirAdam »

PixyMisa wrote: post #164
BirAdam wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the absence of government intervention, wealth is more likely to tend toward the center. The issue is that any democratic form of government featuring any kind of legislature reliant on voting will be bought. First, large companies will want small little advantages like a new road to their factory. Overtime, it becomes massive like immunity from prosecution from drugs that kill people like opioids. Over time, thes…

Corporate personhood is a legal fiction that allows corporations to own property and be sued. It dates back to craft guilds in the bronze age. I'm not sure what alternative you envision.

Sue the owners of corporations when they break laws. That’s my alternative vision. Why did no board members of major tobacco companies have to face the consequences of their actions when they knowingly falsely advertised their product? Take away corporate personhood and make the owners face the music.

Re: The elderly are becoming homeless at a rate not seen since the Great Depression

#994

Post by _maelstrom »

An interesting contrast in this whole debate is Japan, where homes actually depreciate slowly over 20-30 years while the underlying land much more moderately appreciates vs homes in the West [0]. This makes apartments quite cheap, even in popular cities, and the rate of homelessness is quite low [1].

There are small towns trying to sell empty houses for super cheap, though possibly you have to pay to bring them up to code, I am not sure on the details. More recently, renovation has started to become popular [2]. I guess that helps with costs and is more eco-friendly.

I'm not sure if this way of doing it is better but it makes sense to me that the house itself, like a car, should lose value as it ages and its parts will require more servicing and replacement.

[0] https://www.rethinktokyo.com/2018/06/06/depreciate-limited-l...

[1] https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/homelessn...

[2] https://www.theguardian.com/cities/2017/nov/16/japan-reusabl...

Re: The elderly are becoming homeless at a rate not seen since the Great Depression

#995

Post by kyleee »

jjav wrote: post #912
dghlsakjg wrote: post #496

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are a ton of requirements placed on what can even qualify as housing. To stick close to the example, rooming houses (SROs) are effectively illegal in most cities these days. You simply can't have a commercial venture that rents out cheap barebones bedrooms with shared bathrooms. That's due to regulations that were designed to get rid of rooming houses. Bedrooms are also required by law to have a window and clos…

> Bedrooms are also required by law to have a window Windows are required for fire escape, there are good reasons for that.

Indeed you are correct. But there are good reasons (and many deaths, maimings) underlying many of the codes that make building so much more expensive than in the past.

Re: The elderly are becoming homeless at a rate not seen since the Great Depression

#996

Post by momirlan »

XTHK wrote: post #880
momirlan wrote: post #832

Earlier quoted context omitted.

yeah, because you need a lot of labour rights to make a living ... a person with skills and good work ethic will always find work, with or without "rights"

Always find work, sure, but work conditions are a big deal. What ended child labor in (most) of the west? What gave us the weekend? What gave us paid time off? Blood. People had to sacrifice their lives. We have to actively fight for better working conditions.

not much relevant to me, and perhaps a lot of other people. I run my own business so no paid time off. Also, if needed I work weekends too - no issue.

Re: The elderly are becoming homeless at a rate not seen since the Great Depression

#997

Post by AnthonyMouse »

fzeroracer wrote: post #991
AnthonyMouse wrote: post #989

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> In a market where supply is constantly being added to meet demand, you would expect costs to go down in cities where people are leaving. Sufficient supply is not being added to meet demand -- that's why prices keep going up. > For example, NYC's population has remained relatively static or even gone down, but the rent prices sharply go up, far more than inflation. NYC's population grows by about 0.3% every year: ht…

It has nothing to do with inept laws. It has everything to do with the corrupt behavior of often large companies that own all of these rental units. Like I get the feeling you don't rent. When I was living in Austin, my apartment rent shot up over 30%, in an area on the outskirts of Austin near nothing. It's nice to think that this problem could be solved by simply dumping supply on the market, but even in areas wher…

> When I was living in Austin, my apartment rent shot up over 30%, in an area on the outskirts of Austin near nothing.

Austin's population has been increasing by ~4% annually for decades, which is high. Construction responds to that but it has a lead time. And Austin has zoning restrictions, but notice that it also has lower rents than cities that have more.

> It's nice to think that this problem could be solved by simply dumping supply on the market, but even in areas where that's being done or where there isn't significant demand rent is skyrocketing.

Can you name any US city where the amount of net housing growth exceeded the amount of population growth over the last 30 years?

> And even when supply is dropped, it's bought up by said large corporations and investment groups that price fix it anyways.

Most of them are buying it to rent it out, which adds supply to the market. The problem, regardless of who the buyer is, is that they're not building enough pretty much anywhere.

> "They're sort of not advertising their full inventory," Walkup said, "simply because they don't want to overwhelm the idea of what the supply currently is."

That's something else entirely -- they have a bunch of empty apartments and they wait to put some on the market until they fill the others, because why pay to advertise multiple units when they're all about the same? They're effectively all still on the market because as soon as anyone actually rents one they start advertising another one.

What you should be asking is, why don't they lower the prices some so they can rent them all out quickly and get some rent instead of none?

But that is the bad laws. If there is a short-term reduction in demand for urban apartments because of COVID, normally the incentive would be to lower the rents to whatever it takes to fill the units and then raise it again if the demand recovers. But if you have rent control or similar, once they rent it out they'd be stuck getting the short-term lower prices for decades to come, so they'd rather stick it out until they can find a tenant at a higher price.

Get rid of the bad laws and that incentive goes away.

But you still need to allow more housing to be built, because otherwise the rents would go back up as soon as COVID is over and people start moving back into cities.

Urban landlords don't have any kind of market power outside of control over zoning boards -- there are too many of them and none of them own a high enough proportion of the units to make a dent. Which is why they capture zoning boards to prevent supply from increasing to satisfy demand.

Re: The elderly are becoming homeless at a rate not seen since the Great Depression

#998

Post by mikrotikker »

Workaccount2 wrote: post #967
mikrotikker wrote: post #877

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So BlackRock and Vanguard didn't buy up swathes of housing out competing individuals by offering above asking price and then rent or landbank that housing?

That was two years ago.

so?

Re: The elderly are becoming homeless at a rate not seen since the Great Depression

#999

Post by mikrotikker »

HDThoreaun wrote: post #973
mikrotikker wrote: post #877

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So BlackRock and Vanguard didn't buy up swathes of housing out competing individuals by offering above asking price and then rent or landbank that housing?

Not to a level that would make them one of the main culprit's for the housing crisis, no.

Do you have a source for that?

Re: The elderly are becoming homeless at a rate not seen since the Great Depression

#1000

Post by NoZebra120vClip »

bombcar wrote: post #915
NoZebra120vClip wrote: post #896

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the gross monthly income "The" gross monthly income, as if there is one blob of income that we could turn a knob and increase, by say, 10%? Are we doing this across the board, from migrant farmworkers to the Fortune 500 C-levels? Does this dovetail with UBI so that people who earned $0 + entitlements, lose their entitlements and begin receiving cash instead? If rental housing is the #1 monthly expense for the worki…

That's the "affordable housing" twist - housing could be 99% affordable in an area, and due to lack of supply, there could still be a housing crisis.

Have families considered living with one another, rather than constantly splitting apart at first blush and divorcing at drop of hat? Who doesn't hate it these days when Uncle Billy has to move back into the garage? He's your uncle, think about it.

As you increase the difficulty of staying married, and make it trés gauche for women to fulfill destiny as mothers, you increase their difficulty of bearing and raising >0 children, DINKs emerge as the Ideal Consumer, but then you've decimated your future workforce, taxpayers, and caregivers.

I mean, the 50s/60s promoted the Nuclear Family for some reason, and it was probably intended to blow up extended family ties, which can make a populace harder to track and control, and because Nuclear Families tend to drive up demand for discrete housings, and also demand for any and all household goods and resources that can no longer be shared. Hmm.

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