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Leaked data reveals Israeli govt campaign to remove pro-Palestine posts on Meta

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Re: Leaked data reveals Israeli govt campaign to remove pro-Palestine posts on Meta

#981

Post by pbiggar »

cscurmudgeon wrote: post #534
Braxton1980 wrote: post #457

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Another difference would be that you are allowed to express your opinion, whereas in russia you would be put to jail, that's true but only in a very limited way. Although not even close in number and punishment the US government is deporting people for speaking against Israel. I think we do have a much better system because we are aware of these cases, you can speak out about the issue, and our court system can rule…

If you are talking about Khalil, he didn't just speak against Israel, it seems like his role in an org which openly supported Hamas may have played a part but didn't matter legally. The legal issue was that he left out facts on his green card application. I am 100% sure that support of terrorist orgs can invalidate your green card. https://abcnews.go.com/US/trump-administration-claims-palest... > According to recent…

This is part of the trick that israel is trying to pull. Suppose you support Palestine liberation from Israel's violent occupation and apartheid, as does most of the world. Well, so does Hamas, so therefore you support Hamas' goals and are evil and a terrorist.

To apply this in another context, I agree with Trump on very little, but I do agree that Daylight Savings should be gotten rid of. So am I pro-Trump? No, that's absurd.

Or if you are right wing in the US and believe that the US is the land of the free and home of the brave, well, so does Hilary Clinton. Are you pro-Clinton?

The connection is absurd, but it parrotted daily by US politicians and US media.

Re: Leaked data reveals Israeli govt campaign to remove pro-Palestine posts on Meta

#982

Post by pbiggar »

tdeck wrote: post #196

Not a surprise. I remember last year seeing that posts to https://www.birdsofgaza.com/ were being blocked, and it's hard to think of a more innocuous way of speaking out.

Similarly, pro-Palestine content on HN is highly suppressed.

Re: Leaked data reveals Israeli govt campaign to remove pro-Palestine posts on Meta

#983

Post by AtlasBarfed »

mmooss wrote: post #939
AtlasBarfed wrote: post #721

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or are you dismissing overt signalling of fascism as "just owning the libs"? Are you just cherry picking communication you feel safe about and ignoring the huge glaring signs being flashed by dozens of appointees? Are you pretending Obama and bush established legal precedents for classifying citizens as enemy combatants for rendition, denial of due process, and murder by drone without trial? That we don't have a bett…

I'm not sure what you are saying, but I'm not dismissing it, I'm saying we need to stop repeating their propaganda of terror and intimindation as if it's true. Be effective, not spread the poison of helplessness and fear.

We need vigilance and nonpassivity.

Propaganda is targeted to keep the majority passive while awful things are done by the government regime.

Your argument seems to be "ignore them and they will go away". That's not how authoritarian takeovers are prevented.

Re: Leaked data reveals Israeli govt campaign to remove pro-Palestine posts on Meta

#984

Post by canxerian »

aucisson_masque wrote: post #24

I like to think we are in a better place than russia for instance with all its propaganda and jailed journalists, but then i see these kind of article come over and over.... Most of the people in the 'free world' goes on mainstream media, like facebook to get their news. These companies are enticed to 'suck up' to the government because at the end they are business, they need to be in good term with ruling class. you…

Another often overlooked difference is that non US/UK citizens are typically bilingual, so by definition can access more news sources

Re: Leaked data reveals Israeli govt campaign to remove pro-Palestine posts on Meta

#985

Post by skyyler »

breppp wrote: post #979
skyyler wrote: post #978

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The intercept article you linked says HRW gave the money back, so that's kind of a nothingburger, isn't it?

it said that organization reported a company for engaging in slave labor, it then took donations from that company while agreeing not to cover LGBT rights in the middle east in return, but when it was caught it agreed to give the donation back I would hardly describe it as a nothingburger for human rights organization ethics, but that's only me

Fascinating conversation you're having at me here.

Good stuff.

Anything else you'd like to add while you're at it?

Re: Leaked data reveals Israeli govt campaign to remove pro-Palestine posts on Meta

#986

Post by ath3nd »

weatherlite wrote: post #970
ath3nd wrote: post #667

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I do not disagree with your comment in general, I disagree with you putting "Judaism" while the almost all the critique and rebuke is aimed at the Israeli war crimes or the Zionist supremacy ideology. It's good that you brought this up! It's a common right-wing tactic to conflate themselves with the purest version of something that is highly regarded and hide behind it. E.g the Nazis conflated themselves with "pure…

> the same way now Israel conflates itself with Judaism/Jewishness And the same way now progressives conflate Zionists with White supremacists / Nazis.

> And the same way now progressives conflate Zionists with White supremacists / Nazi

Nazism and Zionism are both ultra-right-wing nationalistic ideologies. The conflation doesn't stop on the surface though, but it runs deep in the actions of the two states: The Nazi state during WW2, and the Israeli state:

1. Dehumanizing of "the enemy"

A) Israel dehumanizing Palestinians: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Animal_stereotypes_of_Palestin...

B) Nazis dehumanizing Jews: https://english.elpais.com/society/2022-12-04/how-nazi-propa...

2. Using war crimes like starvation to "get rid of the enemy":

A) Israel starving Palestinians: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaza_Strip_famine

B) Nazis starving Jews: https://www.nobelpeacecenter.org/en/news/hitler-s-hungerplan

3. Detention camps and torture

A) Israel detaining and torturing Palestinians: https://reliefweb.int/report/occupied-palestinian-territory/...

B) Nazis detaining and torturing Jews: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi_concentration_camps

Re: Leaked data reveals Israeli govt campaign to remove pro-Palestine posts on Meta

#987

Post by quails8mydog »

YZF wrote: post #948
quails8mydog wrote: post #941

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I read the 1st third (it's really long) and while the data analysis is interesting, the conclusions say a lot more about the biases of the author(s) than those of the BBC. Fundamentally you can't use sympathy as a measure of bias without first establishing a baseline for how sympathetic the views and/or groups of people are. The report mentions that Palestinians might be more sympathetic because they're the ones bein…

Thanks for giving it a read though. I think it's an interesting question of how we measure bias. For me, as an Israeli (who hasn't lived there for decades), who has some first hand knowledge of the situation, much of the reporting appears to be extremely biased. I know there are claims from the other side the bias goes in the other direction. What's the ground truth? I think using AI to crunch the large amount of dat…

I agree that it's an interesting question, that's why I spent so much of my free time reading it.

I'd also agree that using AI for sentiment analysis could be a good approach, I'm not an expert in the area, but I believe this is one of the things AI is best at. But it needs an extra step to translate that into bias. Establishing a sympathy baseline is my initial idea, but I haven't tested it and maybe there's something better.

Whether something is biased is less about how any given individual(s) feel about what's been said and more about if the different viewpoints are presented honestly. Though it can get really difficult to identify except in the most extreme cases. As you say, it's not just what's said where the bias occurs, but also in the choice of what not to say.

Re: Leaked data reveals Israeli govt campaign to remove pro-Palestine posts on Meta

#988

Post by weatherlite »

ath3nd wrote: post #986
weatherlite wrote: post #970

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the same way now Israel conflates itself with Judaism/Jewishness And the same way now progressives conflate Zionists with White supremacists / Nazis.

> And the same way now progressives conflate Zionists with White supremacists / Nazi Nazism and Zionism are both ultra-right-wing nationalistic ideologies. The conflation doesn't stop on the surface though, but it runs deep in the actions of the two states: The Nazi state during WW2, and the Israeli state: 1. Dehumanizing of "the enemy" A) Israel dehumanizing Palestinians: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Animal_stereot…

Yes Zionists are the Nazis and Hamas are the good guys I got it. Thanks for all the links I read each and every one of them , especially Wikipedia articles about Nazi concentration camps I've never heard of that.

Re: Leaked data reveals Israeli govt campaign to remove pro-Palestine posts on Meta

#989

Post by elihu »

Teever wrote: post #782
elihu wrote: post #458

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would think that anyone advocating for or cheering the death of civilians would be valid reason for removal. Criticizing Israeli policy, being supportive of Palestinians in general, or contradicting Netanyahu's talking points: not a valid reason for removal.

How do you feel about posts supporting the bombing of Dresden, Tokyo, or the use of atomic weapons on Hiroshima and Nagasaki?

Those aren't great either, but a mitigating factor is that those things happened a long time ago in conflicts that have already ended and few of the people involved are even alive anymore. It's not like the United States is seriously considering firebombing Desden or Tokyo or using nuclear weapons against Japan again in 2025. (At least, not yet as far as we know.) Having opinions about history is different than having opinions about an ongoing war.

There's also a difference between people who say that those attacks were a least-bad option to win the war from a utilitarian ethics point of view versus people (presumably a minority) who simply see no down-side at all to deliberately killing large numbers of German or Japanese civilians.

Re: Leaked data reveals Israeli govt campaign to remove pro-Palestine posts on Meta

#990

Post by wordofx »

throw310822 wrote: post #459
cantrecallmypwd wrote: post #414

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hamas isn't an army, it's the political party voted into office to administer Gaza. The problem is a subset of it, the Al-Qassam Brigades, that conduct asymmetric warfare. If that were shutdown and violence were disavowed, that would give them political respect and would cease giving Palestinians a bad name that holds them back from the atrocities committed against them from being recognized.

> that would give them political respect, cease giving Palestinians a bad name that holds them back from the atrocities committed against them from being recognized Yes the respect Fatah has. Look at the strong words of condemnation from world leaders for the daily pogroms Palestinians are subjected to in the West Bank. Look at the apartheid being enforced there, look at the demolished houses and villages, at the hun…

> Hamas has proposed multiple times long term ceasefires (10 years)

Hamas has broken ever cease fire since they took power. There was a ceasefire in place when they attacked Israel.

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