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New iMac with M4

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Re: New iMac with M4

#981

Post by seec »

andrewmcwatters wrote: post #221
simonw wrote: post #144

As someone who mucks around with running LLMs and other large models on my computer the 32GB maximum RAM is a show-stopper for me. I'm on a M2 with 64GB at the moment and I'm already regretting not going for 96 or even 128. I want to be able to run a large model AND other apps at the same time.

I own a MacBook Pro (16-inch, 2021) Apple M1 Max 64 GB. I'm just adding to this that at the time of purchase, this was Apple's top-of-the-line MacBook Pro model, and it's just not that great, in my opinion. Apple's new hardware pales in comparison to the relative abilities of what features existed on a 27-inch iMac with Retina 5K Display 10 years ago. All of the power of modern computers come primarily from their GPU…

Yeah that's pretty much the problem with modern Apple hardware. If you just want a computer to do casual "home" stuff they feel very overpriced for what they will allow you to do, even though the design and build quality are good. And if you start to drop a lot of cash for a very powerful machine, they seem very underwhelming for the amount of cash you will need in comparison to a beastie PC.

The MacBook Pros are in a class of their own but I suspect that most who buy the higher end ones do not actually use the power all that much (they would prefer a real workstation otherwise).

When I used to work at an Apple Premium Service Provider, all the clients who had the high-end MacBook Pro were the executives and people like that who made little use of the power. Every worker, even in media agencies had a desktop workstation (iMac or Mac Pro).

The MacBook Pro craze is mainly a Silicon Valley startup thing.

And yes, Apple computers are mostly useful for design/media work, if you have more use cases you are very likely to hit a roadblock, which is sad for the price.

Re: New iMac with M4

#982

Post by seec »

dialup_sounds wrote: post #297
sigh_again wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

First off, "up to" is the most bullshit metric. I am also up to 10x more productive when I get coffee, but that's when comparing to days where I just play Satisfactory all day long. Secondly, "compared to a random HP AIO PC with a 5 year old CPU" (since there are approximately zero chances that the most popular PC in a market that is heavily Apple dominated would be a 2023 Raptor Lake) is just, once again, Apple's pi…

Nah, it's a Core 7 150U, which is Raptor Lake. The trick is they used a GPU accelerated benchmark (Affinity) that highlights how trash the Intel GPU is.

Yes that's because they don't price match. If they would, the Apple computer would still some better things about it but it wouldn't win a lot of benchmarks, if any...

Re: New iMac with M4

#983

Post by seec »

imac_dscreen wrote: post #856

I will never consider an iMac again because the first iMac I purchased in 2021 (with the M1 chip) had a screen problem immediately after the warranty expired. Many users have reported this problem to Apple, but they have yet to acknowledge the problem. I am very disappointed in Apple. They lie about sustainability https://discussions.apple.com/thread/255220596?answerId=2604...

Welcome to reality. The one where most Apple products actually have a problem with them but for the most part many of their rich customers do not see them because they appear further down the line. Usually around 3 year mark and further.

But you will find plenty of Apple aficionados who buy/resell their Apple stuff yearly or bi-annually who tells you they never have problems; not realizing they sold their problems.

I have been buying Apple hardware since the early 2000 and I have way more issues than is reasonable for the price paid. It's like German cars, you pay more because they look cool, they run fast but not necessarily because they are more reliable. If anything, they are going to break down more and cost a lot more to repair...

Re: New iMac with M4

#984

Post by seec »

dijit wrote: post #128
epolanski wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You just reminded me of how stupid the plug beneath the MM was...You never needed to charge it, till you needed it and couldn't use the mouse.

There are so many legitimate reasons to hate the magic mouse. Ergonimics, the polling rate, the way the glass gets greasy, the scratchy hard plastic on the bottom. Truly, inferior to the Logitech MX Master in all ways except looks. (which is subjective). But it takes literally a few seconds to get a days worth of charge out of the mouse, Apple clearly don't want you to leave it plugged in to use as a wired mouse: why…

They are just lazy and cheap and can't admit they were wrong. That's it. Because the current Magic Mouse is basically a battery version of the previous Magic Mouse that used swappable batteries. As far as I'm concerned, they basically just used the same exact hardware and swapped the battery cradle for a LIPO + BMS and Lightning port. Which is actually a problem in itself because the sensor is really not great and could have used an upgrade at least.

I have had and used both and the first version was MUCH less annoying. Swapping is an instant activity and back to business; remember to put it to charge later when you get a message is an unnecessary mental load and unrealistic expectation from the user, the technology is supposed to work for the user not the other way around. The fast-charging bullshit everyone talks about is just displacement of the problem, the next day you will get another interruption and mental load to remember to charge.

On top of that, the battery life is actually terrible, it's crazy how little useful life you get from it considering how heavy it is and how terrible the sensor is.

Personally, I really like the ability to "free scroll" in all direction on the surface and the 2-3 finger swipes but it's really not worth the hassle.

People boast about Apple trackpads being good but as far as I'm concerned, they don't have much choice considering that's the only thing they seem to be able to work out ok. Nobody on PCs wants to use trackpads, it makes no sense compared to the performance of a mouse and gestures are unreliable compared to mouse buttons/keyboard shortcuts/macro keys.

Re: New iMac with M4

#986

Post by PeterCorless »

1123581321 wrote: post #624
PeterCorless wrote: post #622

I was really hoping they'd have announced a MacBook Pro based on M4. I had been waiting all year for it. https://www.macrumors.com/2024/03/11/apple-reportedly-develo... However, reading Nanoreview it looks like the performance of the M3 Max still actually beats the M4 for graphics and multicore performance. https://nanoreview.net/en/cpu-compare/apple-m4-vs-apple-m3-m...

They are supposedly launching Macs all week, so you will probably get your M4 Pro and Max MBPs. M4 Max vs. M3 Max will be the apples-to-apples comparison to make.

And lo an behold!

https://www.apple.com/macbook-pro/?afid=p238%7CstiyKw4MH-dc_...

Re: New iMac with M4

#987

Post by fennecbutt »

massysett wrote: post #562
jprd wrote: post #235

I love the innovation Apple has brought with their investment in ARM. That said, I can't imagine buying a computer in the 21st century that can't be opened and upgraded, especially with a price premium attached. I just don't get it. I am in no way trying to be combative, but I'd love to hear a counterpoint that makes sense for these machines.

The computer that can be opened is larger and more janky. Most users derive absolutely no utility from ability to open the machine, as they will never open it. They do however benefit from a smaller, more aesthetic computer. I have plenty of space next to my desk for a mini-tower computer - something like a Micro ATX. Since trading it for an ultra small form factor that's the size of a paperback book, I wouldn't go b…

Tbf I agree with this sentiment. For phones and laptops for sure. But what I don't like is the premium they charge on memory, it's just ridiculous. And the sad thing is that Apple fans don't realise they could make things collectively better for everyone by sticking their feet down and saying no, this isn't fair to force Apple to change - but instead people will just defend the company.

They do make excellent laptops, but I absolutely loathe the suits and ties that run the place.

Re: New iMac with M4

#988

Post by fennecbutt »

danso wrote: post #788

I've held off replacing my MBP for about 5 years. In the meantime I built my own PC with an Nvidia card, but I have to admit it's been such a nuisance to get CUDA set up (I started doing it when WSL documentation wasn't quite fully baked) that I'm nostalgic for the days of doing `brew install everything`. The state of AI and other development in macOS seems like it's been pretty popular and solid for the past few yea…

An M chip will still not compare at all to any decent discrete GPU when it comes to AI stuff. Unless you're going cloud like runpod or something.

Truth to be told what I'm likely going to continue to do is laptop as thin client and desktop with beefy gpu as workhorse, that's worked pretty well so far.

Re: New iMac with M4

#989

Post by pmarreck »

sroussey wrote: post #405
pmarreck wrote: post #377

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Came here to post this. Although I'm looking for an M4 Macbook Pro with 128GB RAM for the same reason. This going to be announced? #OneOfUs #OneOfUs

My guess is Wednesday. - iMac today, USB accessories - Mac Mini on Tuesday, likely debut M4 Pro - MacBooks on Wednesday, debut M4 Max Now in the “I wish” category (zero percent chance): - Thursday would be MacStudio with HBM memory for Max and Ultra - Friday would be macPro with 1 to 4 Ultra in NUMA configuration. Now I don’t believe those last two. But I do want to see the X-ray of the max chip to see if it has the…

you were spot-on! Ordered!

Re: New iMac with M4

#990

Post by anticensor »

capitol_ wrote: post #952
Teever wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd love to see a regulator mandate that computers like the iMac that have built in screens must have HDMI ports that allow them to be used as monitors. This would be great for the consumer and prevent a lot of ewaste as people can use obsolete computers as monitors well past their useful lifespan as a monitor.

HDMI is really not a very good choice as they try to block open source implementations: https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2024/02/hdmi-forum-to-amd-no... It should be kept out of regulations.

This is why we need a standard that has both HDMI and DP connector options, but DP signalling.
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