Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

All Tesla Cars Being Produced Now Have Full Self-Driving Hardware

tesla.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

981–990 of 1001 posts

Re: All Tesla Cars Being Produced Now Have Full Self-Driving Hardware

#981

Post by StRoy »

jkchu wrote: post #894
woodpanel wrote: post #844

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Continuing that path I'd say: Tesla gets software right. Way better than what I've seen in other cars. But what stops that iPhone metaphor for me is Design, Materials and Finish. Apple Products look and feel like luxury. Where as Tesla only achieves that on the software side - and in your pocket.

I wouldn't be surprised if most people disagreed with your notion that Tesla cars do not look luxurious.

They only look luxurious from the exterior, the interior is really pitiful for the price when compared to a samely priced car from, say, BMW.

Re: All Tesla Cars Being Produced Now Have Full Self-Driving Hardware

#982

Post by U2407_U0003 »

drcross wrote: post #734
vkou wrote: post #724

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's just hilarious the contortions of logic people will go to in order to put Musk down. It's probably because there is a substantial gap between what Musk spins, and reality. Take Tesla 3 pre-orders, for instance. Tesla spins 400,000 pre-orders for a car that you might not receive in the next three years as the most amazing innovation in automobile manufacturing. Historically, there have been a few other companie…

>what Musk spins, and reality. The reality is that they are the first serious electric car company. A tiny enterprise that took on the old Detroit giants and is winning. When you see people putting down hard earned cash for something three years into the future, they are not being tricked, they are investing in disruption. He's such a terrible orator you couldn't describe him as a charlatan. It's his actions and peop…

Are they competing against Detroit though, or against Ingolstadt, Stuttgart, Yokohama and Munich?

Re: All Tesla Cars Being Produced Now Have Full Self-Driving Hardware

#983

Post by U2407_U0003 »

the_duke wrote: post #678
JulianMorrison wrote: post #614

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's going to be slow until it happens in a rush, I think. There will be a tipping point where enough cars are self driving that it stops being a geeky add-on and starts being seen as a moral necessity. Roughly at the point where government statistics of manual versus self driving motor accident rates gain enough data to be comparable. There will be a huge public to-and-fro about negligence versus freedom, with drivi…

Yeah, once the technology stabilizes and the legal and regulatory frameworks have been established, there will be a big wave of adoption. I predict that many in bigger cities will give up on owning their own car, and join car sharing services. Then you can choose between a private car just for you, or a shared ride where the car optimizes routes and picks up multiple people. Other benefits: it's just you? take a smal…

>I predict that many in bigger cities will give up on owning their own car, and join car sharing services.

>Then you can choose between a private car just for you, or a shared ride where the car optimizes routes and picks up multiple people.

>Other benefits: it's just you? take a small 2 person car. On the way to a party with some friends? Get a nice Mercedes to drive you there. Need to transport some furniture? Get a pickup.

That's how I and many others are already living their lives. I don't see how self-driving figures into that development, really...

Re: All Tesla Cars Being Produced Now Have Full Self-Driving Hardware

#984

Post by roel_v »

jkchu wrote: post #894
woodpanel wrote: post #844

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Continuing that path I'd say: Tesla gets software right. Way better than what I've seen in other cars. But what stops that iPhone metaphor for me is Design, Materials and Finish. Apple Products look and feel like luxury. Where as Tesla only achieves that on the software side - and in your pocket.

I wouldn't be surprised if most people disagreed with your notion that Tesla cars do not look luxurious.

At the risk of sounding like a nationalistic asshole, Teslas look very American - i.e., a mix of cheap and tacky. Put a 5 series bmw next to it - two different leagues really. I want to root for Tesla, and I'd buy one if I could park it somewhere where I could charge it, but I don't think they're doing great in the looks department, especially not to Europeans.

Re: All Tesla Cars Being Produced Now Have Full Self-Driving Hardware

#985

Post by roel_v »

tempestn wrote: post #925
sbierwagen wrote: post #809

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If we're continuing the iPhone metaphor from the GP, note that Apple is almost always late to a market segment. When the iPhone was released, Windows CE had owned the smartphone segment for years. The iPod was hardly the first hard drive mp3 player. Apple Watch wasn't the first smart watch. Etc etc etc. Apple makes good products, not innovative ones. It is not at all unthinkable that someone else will release a bette…

The iPhone was the first smartphone without a physical keyboard, allowing for a much more functional screen in a convenient form factor, right? I recall it seeming like a non-trivial difference at the time, and clearly a game-changing one.

Palm treo/tungsten had a keyboard but also a good screen and were far more functional than the first iphones. Not as flashy and the software was much more expensive though.

Re: All Tesla Cars Being Produced Now Have Full Self-Driving Hardware

#986

Post by roel_v »

tempestn wrote: post #953
jaxn wrote: post #927

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No. There was a Palm Treo smartphone without a keyboard first. It even had a 3rd party app ecosystem.

All the pictures I can find of Palm Treos have keyboards. Which model was it that didn't?

Some models of the Tungsten didn't have keyboard. Most palms didn't, the advantage of the treo was that it did so you didn't have to learn the palm handwriting system. The screens weren't sensitive enough for on screen keyboards.

Re: All Tesla Cars Being Produced Now Have Full Self-Driving Hardware

#987

Post by EmployedRussian »

davedx wrote: post #432
svantana wrote: post #382

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That I would call: driving autonomously with a human driver ready to take over if something unexpected were to happen. I believe that to get to superhuman performance (which is probably what will be needed to make it legal) you will need 360 degree ranging (i.e. LIDAR). Also, it is inevitable that these sensors will become so cheap that it's a no-brainer to include them.

You said: "Tesla's sensor suite is too weak to ever get to full autonomy" The video clearly shows a fully autonomous vehicle in a range of driving conditions. How about accepting that the sensor suite is adequate?

> The video clearly shows a fully autonomous vehicle in a range of driving conditions.

The video shows a fully autonomous vehicle in a range of (relatively) easy driving conditions.

1. There is not a single "sticky" situation in that video. Handling 90% of situations is (relatively) easy; it's the last 1% that is extremely hard.

2. It's not clear how many tries it took to record that video, but likely more than one.

3. At the end of the video, the car drives in the opposite lane of where it's supposed to. That smells of a highly-staged demo, not a general purpose solution.

In short, this video in no way proves that the sensor suite is anywhere close to being sufficient. Can that car repeat the same trip at night? In rain? Can it drive down Castro St. in Mountain View or University St. in Palo Alto at lunch time? Etc. etc.

Re: All Tesla Cars Being Produced Now Have Full Self-Driving Hardware

#988

Post by CamperBob2 »

jfoster wrote: post #166
CamperBob2 wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Autopilot is the correct term. I'm tired of always having to cater to the lowest common denominator. Ask 99 out of 100 people who aren't pilots, but who might be Tesla customers, and see if they can recite what you wrote below: While on autopilot you are still expected to be monitoring the flight and take control at a moments notice. Autopilot does not allow the pilot to take a nap or go in the back and party with th…

Shouldn't what matters be how many people become actual Tesla owners using autopilot without realising this? For that metric, I suspect the answer is much closer to 0.

Well, the answer clearly isn't 0, as you could tell if you'd opened a newspaper recently, watched the news, or read the link.

Human factors are a thing. And it's a little scary that some guys who build rockets and plan Mars missions on the side don't seem to understand that.

Re: All Tesla Cars Being Produced Now Have Full Self-Driving Hardware

#989

Post by CamperBob2 »

WalterBright wrote: post #72
thesimon wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>From a PR perspective, the name was a solid gold decision. I doubt it. It creates false hopes and probably hurted/hurts them when crashs happen. The Tesla autopilot death in June was a really big thing, yet other crashes where assistant systems of other manufacturers are never in the press. Maybe because of the name, maybe because the drivers use them better? Also look at what happened recently in Germany: 1. Basica…

The autopilot in an airplane cannot be used without a pilot paying attention, either, but it is still called an autopilot. (For example, autopilots do not avoid traffic on a collision course.)

Of course it can be used without a pilot paying attention. But this rarely happens. If we trained drivers the way we train pilots, it wouldn't be a problem in cars, either.

Also, the comparison would be more relevant if you had as much time to correct problems that occur eight feet away from an oncoming lane of 70 MPH traffic, and as many degrees of freedom in which to do so, as you do when something goes wrong with nothing but 10,000 feet of air around you.

Air safety is an intimidating engineering problem, but it's utterly trivial compared to what it will take to build safe self-driving cars. Make no mistake, it's about time we tried... but we just need to not be stupid about it. Calling a glorified cruise control "Autopilot" is stupid.

Re: All Tesla Cars Being Produced Now Have Full Self-Driving Hardware

#990

Post by BWStearns »

imh wrote: post #837
BWStearns wrote: post #610

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why make it centralized? I generally am suspicious of "anonymized" datasets (in the abstract) as any usable data is probably enough to nonymize someone given a couple other pieces of data. Forgive me if you didn't mean a centralized system but I took upload and anonymize to suggest that. In the case of cars some radio comms (uhf, wifi, or even bluetooth?) is probably sufficient since there is no reason for a car in N…

Don't worry. It's not you, it's an anonymous person who leaves your house every morning and comes back after working in the same place you do. Nobody could ever associate that with you.

Oh good. I feel better now.
Post reply on HN