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Trump administration halts Harvard's ability to enroll international students

nytimes.com

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Re: Trump administration halts Harvard's ability to enroll international students

#971

Post by EasyMark »

bloomingeek wrote: post #376
ar813 wrote: post #10

If they can do this to Harvard, what hope do other universities have?

Great question, right to the heart of the matter. First higher learning, somewhere down the line, ordinary people? In my small world, I'm very clear I'm anti-trump on every issue. As an ordinary person, how long before I get on some Stalin type radar? If trump lobbies for and gets a third term, will there be an awakening to how far the abuse will go?

dictators always start with the groups they hate most and then move down the list. Trump has always hated elite universities and academia.

Re: Trump administration halts Harvard's ability to enroll international students

#972

Post by anonfordays »

spacemadness wrote: post #688
neumann wrote: post #546

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They (the current administration) doesn't want to be competitive. They want to be in full control and willing to destroy any institution, organization or person that opposes them, internal or external.

Can we say "fascism" out loud yet or are moderates still pretending everything is fine?

The other side four years ago:

Can we say "Marxism" out loud yet or are moderates still pretending everything is fine?

Re: Trump administration halts Harvard's ability to enroll international students

#973

Post by kbigdelysh »

fnordpiglet wrote: post #283
kochb wrote: post #20

Don’t miss this bit. Currently enrolled students are going to need to find a new university. > In a news release, the Department of Homeland Security sent a stark message to Harvard’s international students: “This means Harvard can no longer enroll foreign students, and existing foreign students must transfer or lose their legal status.”

Which isn’t at all how PhD programs work. This is a supreme dick move to students are going to be forced to leave with an AbD for no other reason than Trumps ego. This is going to burn the children of the most powerful families across the world. Monarchies, dictators, owners of international conglomerates, etc all send their kids to Harvard. Destroying their children’s education out of a fit of malice is going to hau…

You're very wrong if you think harvard accepts children of dictators and monarchies for its graduate programs. It's near impossible to get into those program except if you are a genius (exceptionally high GPA and GRE grades, published valuable scientific papers in prestigious journals). Just check the graduate student's directory to see what I mean.

Re: Trump administration halts Harvard's ability to enroll international students

#974

Post by mptest »

anonfordays wrote: post #972
spacemadness wrote: post #688

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can we say "fascism" out loud yet or are moderates still pretending everything is fine?

The other side four years ago: Can we say "Marxism" out loud yet or are moderates still pretending everything is fine?

[flagged]

Re: Trump administration halts Harvard's ability to enroll international students

#975

Post by jachee »

neogodless wrote: post #589
jachee wrote: post #492

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The day Kilmar Abrego Garcia was supposed to be brought back, but defiantly wasn’t.

You know, usually I'd assume this was a misspelling of "definitely" but this time, I'm really not sure.

It was definitely a deliberate choice. :)

Re: Trump administration halts Harvard's ability to enroll international students

#976

Post by NoImmatureAdHom »

sneak wrote: post #941
NoImmatureAdHom wrote: post #928

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's protected speech if you're a citizen, but it's not clear to me that non-citizens, especially when they're at the border rather than within the country, would be so-protected.

Aren’t we talking about a green card holder who is a resident here, specifically, in this sub thread? sorcerer-ma’s comment made it sound like we are speaking of Mahmoud Khalil and others. I am under the impression that the settled law is that 1A applies to everyone physically present in the country.

It's an interesting question.

A little reading leads me to believe:

- 1A limits what congress may do, "Congress shall make no law...". It does not positively define what people may do, and therefore doesn't pick out a class of people to whom it applies.

- It is settled that the U.S. government may condition immigration-related decisions on your speech and actions. They don't have to let in an Al-Qaeda member when he shows up at the border, and they don't have to give a pro-HAMAS agitator in the country on a temporary visa a green card. It's still not totally clear to me if a green card might have some sort of special-but-noncitizen status, and maybe it's not clear in general.

- The U.S. government asks people who are applying for entry or a visa questions like, "Are you a terrorist, or have you ever belonged to or supported terrorist organizations?". Part of the reason they do this is to catch you in a lie if it then turns out that you are e.g. supporting HAMAS. If you lied on your immigration documents, they can throw you out.

- For this reason, it seems like e.g. refusing to renew a visa on the grounds of HAMAS support would be fine. But maybe canceling a visa and kicking someone out wouldn't be fine?

Re: Trump administration halts Harvard's ability to enroll international students

#977

Post by sorcerer-mar »

NoImmatureAdHom wrote: post #927
sorcerer-mar wrote: post #908

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Few understand this. You’re allowed to openly advocate for whatever absolutely insane, horrific ideas you want. You’re allowed to be a Nazi, you’re allowed to be a Hamas (non-financial) supporter, you’re allowed to be a pro-Gaza genocide advocate if you want. You can advocate for the extermination or enslavement of all black or white or Christian or atheist or gay people if you want. You may (and probably should) bec…

YES! The question is: To whom do these rights extend in the U.S.? They certainly don't extend to foreigners at the border (any country would rightly turn away an avowed Al-Qaeda member). Foreigners in the U.S. are in the U.S. at the pleasure of the government. Do foreigners currently in the U.S. have these rights? I don't know for sure, maybe it's not a settled issue. My guess is that the U.S. gov't asks "Are you a t…

It's not that complicated.

The country obviously has no obligation to give visas to anyone. However, once you are within US jurisdiction (i.e. in the country), you have a suite of Constitutional rights including (unambiguously) 1st Amendment and 5th Amendment rights. So, correct, they definitely cannot be deported without due process. They cannot be deported even with due process for protected speech. They cannot even lose their visas for protected speech. There are a million different reasons the government may decline to give someone a visa or they may revoke one, but "engaging in protected speech" is not one of them.

And yes, yelling "kill all X" during a protest is protected speech in this country, which AFAIK is far beyond what any of these people are alleged to have done.

Re: Trump administration halts Harvard's ability to enroll international students

#978

Post by zeven7 »

input_sh wrote: post #586
miffy900 wrote: post #563

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From the wikipedia article: > Curtis Yarvin began constructing the basis of the ideology in the late 2000 Ah yes of course this dude is involved. The more I read about Curtis Y, the more I believe he suffers from some sort of undiagnosed mental illness.

No work of fiction prepared me for the most influential "intellectual" to be a dude with a Substack blog that acts as a how-to guide on how to overturn a democracy, which is then followed by the most powerful country in the world a full election cycle after it started being written.

From what I remember, not that far from Peter Wiggin's character in Ender's Game?

Re: Trump administration halts Harvard's ability to enroll international students

#980

Post by lightbendover »

ndsipa_pomu wrote: post #873
moralestapia wrote: post #793

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You cannot jump over immigration requirements "just because you're powerful", and the vast majority of them are not US citizens.

You could probably get round immigration requirements by "gifting" a jet or something

[dead]
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