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The majority of 18- to 29-year-olds in the US are now living with their parents

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Re: The majority of 18- to 29-year-olds in the US are now living with their parents

#961

Post by tripzilch »

hosh wrote: post #800
tuna-piano wrote: post #632

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While it's true this seems like a strong US thing, I haven't heard many happy long-term stories of folks living intergenerationally. In my experience (talking to people from a variety of countries), most couples in their 20s/30s want their own place (even in the countries where it's not common). It seems it can even lead to happier intergenerational relationships when the roomate-type fights don't need to happen. It…

Some thoughts about that: 1. In the US, zoning laws discourage building things like the "mother in-law suite". These zoning laws were originally created as a way to get around federal laws prohibiting discrimination of race and sex by making it more difficult for people who can't afford housing to live within a certain neighborhood. Even if US residents wanted to add housing for some semblance of independence, zoning…

> These zoning laws were originally created as a way to get around federal laws prohibiting discrimination of race and sex by making it more difficult for people who can't afford housing to live within a certain neighborhood.

I'm not from the US but I'm just not sure I'm reading this right, you say these zoning laws are literally racist? And they're still around??

Re: The majority of 18- to 29-year-olds in the US are now living with their parents

#962

Post by Gibbon1 »

tripzilch wrote: post #961
hosh wrote: post #800

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some thoughts about that: 1. In the US, zoning laws discourage building things like the "mother in-law suite". These zoning laws were originally created as a way to get around federal laws prohibiting discrimination of race and sex by making it more difficult for people who can't afford housing to live within a certain neighborhood. Even if US residents wanted to add housing for some semblance of independence, zoning…

> These zoning laws were originally created as a way to get around federal laws prohibiting discrimination of race and sex by making it more difficult for people who can't afford housing to live within a certain neighborhood. I'm not from the US but I'm just not sure I'm reading this right, you say these zoning laws are literally racist? And they're still around??

This is a good resource based on and linking to historical documents.

https://dsl.richmond.edu/panorama/redlining/#loc=14/34.021/-...

Note the description under population.

"Shifting or Infiltration: Negroes and Japanese increasingly numerous"

If a neighborhood had a couple of Black, Asian, or Mexican families banks weren't allowed to issue mortgages or other types of real estate loans. The US built a lot of suburbs post WWII those were restricted to white families only. Blacks, Asians, and Hispanics weren't allowed to buy and also were banned from receiving FHA Loans.

The current battle in the US politically is over whether to return to this state of affairs.

Re: The majority of 18- to 29-year-olds in the US are now living with their parents

#963

Post by 6510 »

throwawayinfo wrote: post #956
6510 wrote: post #955

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When, if or where people are either poor or primitive enough it works like this: You build a house then you live in it. There is nothing in this that suggests one needs to spend 1/4 or 2/3 of the productive labor in their lives to maintain the house. Progress is to reduce the maintenance cost. The lower it is the lower the salaries can be which increase productivity exponentially. IOW grandpa's pension plan is for a…

It's still possible possible to build a house today and live in it, and there is plenty of land, even some going for cheap. But most people don't want that because they make that trade off for today's luxuries.

Actually it is not, we very much need these people to do all kinds of work for us.

Re: The majority of 18- to 29-year-olds in the US are now living with their parents

#964

Post by pnutjam »

tengbretson wrote: post #932
pnutjam wrote: post #922

Earlier quoted context omitted.

corporations != people The press does it's fair share, but you're wrong. Don't be afraid of change. If something isn't working; we should fix it.

Perhaps corporations are not people, however "the press" is made of corporations. If there is to be no restriction on the press then what is to stop any corporate entity from advancing the cause of their politics as a member of the so-called press? > Don't be afraid of change. If something isn't working; we should fix it. Furthermore, this is a binary line of thinking that isn't even fit for a children's book. The wo…

You're listing one possibly problem when this addresses dozens of issues. Removing corporate money from law making will make it was easier to address these issues in the future, with sensible legislation.

Re: The majority of 18- to 29-year-olds in the US are now living with their parents

#965

Post by dghughes »

fourzs wrote: post #321
dghughes wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've seen a documentary about San Francisco it's crazy how middle income people are being pushed farther from the city. One teacher had several bus transfers and then a long walk to get to her job. Even bus stops where "poor" people (less than $100,000/year) are being crowded by private buses like Google forcing city buses to wait which adds to the wait down the line. Nuts!

Does anyone happen to know the name of this doc?

I tried to find it but no luck.

The main part of the documentary is a teacher who can't afford to live anywhere near the school that employs her. I think the cheapest rent was $3,500/month and she made 60K per year (?). I believe she worked in San Francisco but had to move to Oakland. She had to take multiple buses and then walk a few miles from the final stop. But in the end she found a place in San Francisco near her school which she could afford.

It also showed Google and other large companies with their private buses. There was a lot of conflict between average citizens and the "Google buses", at least in the video there was.

Re: The majority of 18- to 29-year-olds in the US are now living with their parents

#966

Post by kortilla »

hosh wrote: post #921
unishark wrote: post #910

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A granny flat or mother-in-law suite would be cheating. It's a separate apartment. Your parents are your neighbors not your room-mates anymore. Education in other countries is far more strict and regimented than the US. Especially Asia. I've always thought the main driver for leaving home is instinctive, basically teenage rebelliousness. If there's cultural "programming" going on, it is just as likely to be in the so…

> A granny flat or mother-in-law suite would be cheating. It's a separate apartment. Your parents are your neighbors not your room-mates anymore. That's correct. It gives some semblance of independence. My point with that one is that even if US residents were inclined to "cheat", current zoning laws in most municipalities makes building additions, or expanding to duplexes and triplexes illegal. Other things like, req…

> US had a literacy rate of 99%, in a nation of farmers. Kids were taught at home or in one-room schools. It was understood that the main purpose of education was not to create factory workers, but to have critically-thinking and informed citizens in a republic. The contrast between that and our current generation of algorithm-driven conspiracy theories is stark.

That is complete bullshit. In 1870 there was a 20% illiteracy rate: https://nces.ed.gov/NAAL/lit_history.asp

I suggest you seriously reconsider your views on how the current education system works vs how it used to be back when people were on farms and learning in one room schoolhouses. It smells to me like you’ve been fed a line of bullshit by someone who has a beef with the current system and just wants to paint the ignorance-filled past with rose-colored enlightenment glasses. This society of highly literate, critical thinking farmers did not exist.

Re: The majority of 18- to 29-year-olds in the US are now living with their parents

#967

Post by Lammy »

munificent wrote: post #464

I really love the quote at the end: > I'm a dad who is happy to have his daughter and fiancé living with me. They pay the utilities and make me nice meals, and it makes it a lot less lonely here. ... I like the multi-generational thing. I know it won't last forever, but it makes life better for now. It's so easy to get into that cold statistical mindset about these large-scale trends, but it's good to remember that t…

That’s cool and all except the part where it’s literally illegal to build housing suited to this arrangement in many places, like in the majority of the land area of San Francisco: https://sf-planning.org/sites/default/files/FileCenter/Docum...

Re: The majority of 18- to 29-year-olds in the US are now living with their parents

#968

Post by alfiedotwtf »

kortilla wrote: post #966
hosh wrote: post #921

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> A granny flat or mother-in-law suite would be cheating. It's a separate apartment. Your parents are your neighbors not your room-mates anymore. That's correct. It gives some semblance of independence. My point with that one is that even if US residents were inclined to "cheat", current zoning laws in most municipalities makes building additions, or expanding to duplexes and triplexes illegal. Other things like, req…

> US had a literacy rate of 99%, in a nation of farmers. Kids were taught at home or in one-room schools. It was understood that the main purpose of education was not to create factory workers, but to have critically-thinking and informed citizens in a republic. The contrast between that and our current generation of algorithm-driven conspiracy theories is stark. That is complete bullshit. In 1870 there was a 20% ill…

This.

See my comment above :)

Re: The majority of 18- to 29-year-olds in the US are now living with their parents

#969

Post by alfiedotwtf »

hosh wrote: post #921
unishark wrote: post #910

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A granny flat or mother-in-law suite would be cheating. It's a separate apartment. Your parents are your neighbors not your room-mates anymore. Education in other countries is far more strict and regimented than the US. Especially Asia. I've always thought the main driver for leaving home is instinctive, basically teenage rebelliousness. If there's cultural "programming" going on, it is just as likely to be in the so…

> A granny flat or mother-in-law suite would be cheating. It's a separate apartment. Your parents are your neighbors not your room-mates anymore. That's correct. It gives some semblance of independence. My point with that one is that even if US residents were inclined to "cheat", current zoning laws in most municipalities makes building additions, or expanding to duplexes and triplexes illegal. Other things like, req…

> It was understood that the main purpose of education was not to create factory workers, but to have critically-thinking and informed citizens in a republic

Lol. Read Wealth of Nations by Adam Smith... having children was for the purpose of making you rich!

Also, that’s if you even made it to the age of 14. In 1870, survival rate of reaching to the age of 14 was about 30%

Re: The majority of 18- to 29-year-olds in the US are now living with their parents

#970

Post by hosh »

kortilla wrote: post #966
hosh wrote: post #921

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> A granny flat or mother-in-law suite would be cheating. It's a separate apartment. Your parents are your neighbors not your room-mates anymore. That's correct. It gives some semblance of independence. My point with that one is that even if US residents were inclined to "cheat", current zoning laws in most municipalities makes building additions, or expanding to duplexes and triplexes illegal. Other things like, req…

> US had a literacy rate of 99%, in a nation of farmers. Kids were taught at home or in one-room schools. It was understood that the main purpose of education was not to create factory workers, but to have critically-thinking and informed citizens in a republic. The contrast between that and our current generation of algorithm-driven conspiracy theories is stark. That is complete bullshit. In 1870 there was a 20% ill…

According to that article you linked, the method in which they were using puts the 1979 literacy rate at 0.6%.

"The more recent focus on illiteracy has centered on functional literacy, which addresses the issue of whether a person's educational level is sufficient to function in a modern society. The earlier surveys of illiteracy examined a very fundamental level of reading and writing. The percent of illiteracy, according to earlier measurement methods, was less than 1 percent of persons 14 years old and over in 1979."

I don't know where that 99% figure that John Gatto Taylor came from. He did talk about a significantly lower literacy rate in the 1970s. I think if one were to use functional literacy as the metric, there would still be a similar decrease literacy rate.

And no, Taylor was not trying to paint the past with rose-colored glasses. Whether or not the farming society did a good enough job as citizens, the frame in which education was viewed was much different. The things from the past is not necessarily better, but neither are the way we are doing things right now.

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