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X offices raided in France as UK opens fresh investigation into Grok

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Re: X offices raided in France as UK opens fresh investigation into Grok

#951

Post by direwolf20 »

master-lincoln wrote: post #813
direwolf20 wrote: post #790

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Naked kid pictures intended for sexual gratification are illegal in most countries

Hard to know the intent of a picture in most cases. E.g. there used to be a magazine for teens when I grew up showing a picture of a naked adolescent of each sex in every edition (Bravo Dr Sommer). The intent was to educate teens and to make them feel less ashamed. I bet there were people who used these for sexual gratification. Should that have been a reason to ban them? I don't think so.

Do you think the judge is stupid? The naked kid pics aren't printed in an anatomical textbook. Because they're AI hallucinations, I doubt they're even anatomically correct.

Re: X offices raided in France as UK opens fresh investigation into Grok

#952

Post by watwut »

Levitz wrote: post #907
fyredge wrote: post #860

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unlike the current American administration who condones raids on homes without warrants and justifies violence with lies, this France raid follows something called rule of law. So no, don't be coy and pretend that all governments are like American institutions.

>Unlike the current American administration who condones raids on homes without warrants and justifies violence with lies, this France raid follows something called rule of law. Iffy on that front, actually. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arrest_and_indictment_of_Pavel...

There was legal warrant and the wikipedia does not mention any lies or rules being being broken. There is nothing "Iffy" on that front.

And, to spell it out, it is also funny to see who was complaining about it back then. On the free speech grounds, not less, literally people trying to dismantle democracy and create autocracy. Russian soldiers and operators, Maria Butina, Medvedev and Elon Musk. Bad faith actors having bad faith arguments.

Re: X offices raided in France as UK opens fresh investigation into Grok

#953

Post by direwolf20 »

Pedro_Ribeiro wrote: post #935
direwolf20 wrote: post #656

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My computer has a copy of all the source code I work on

Can your computer hold a database with trillions of tweets and sensitive user information? FFS

Are they after a database of trillions of tweets and sensitive user information? Is that all that could possibly progress the case?

Re: X offices raided in France as UK opens fresh investigation into Grok

#954

Post by ytpete »

ReptileMan wrote: post #689
mnewme wrote: post #676

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree that users who break the law must be prosecuted. But that doesn’t remove responsibility from tool providers when harm is predictable, scalable, and preventable by design. We already apply this logic elsewhere. Car makers must include seatbelts. Pharma companies must ensure safety. Platforms must moderate illegal content. Responsibility is shared when the risk is systemic.

>But that doesn’t remove responsibility from tool providers when harm is predictable, scalable, and preventable by design. Platforms moderating illegal content is exactly what we are arguing about, so you can't use it as an argument. The rest cases you list are harms to the people using the tools/products. It is not harms that people using the tools inflict on third parties. We are literally arguing about 3d printer…

3D printers don't synthesize content for you though. If they could generate 3D models of CSAM from thin air and then print them, I'm sure they'd be investigated too if they were sold with no guardrails in place.

Re: X offices raided in France as UK opens fresh investigation into Grok

#955

Post by ytpete »

pdpi wrote: post #456
moolcool wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This looks like plain political pressure. No lives were saved, and no crime was prevented by harassing local workers. The company made and released a tool with seemingly no guard-rails, which was used en masse to generate deepfakes and child pornography.

I'm of two minds about this. One the one hand, it seems "obvious" that Grok should somehow be legally required to have guardrails stopping it from producing kiddie porn. On the other hand, it also seems "obvious" that laws forcing 3D printers to detect and block attempts to print firearms are patently bullshit. The thing is, I'm not sure how I can reconcile those two seemingly-obvious statements in a principled manne…

The 3D printers don't generate the plans for the gun for you though. If someone sold a printer that would – happily with no guardrails – generate 3D models of CSAM from thin air and then print them, I bet they'd be investigated too. Or for that matter a 3D printer that came bundled with a built-in library of gun models you could print with very little skill...

Re: X offices raided in France as UK opens fresh investigation into Grok

#956

Post by guerrilla »

mnewme wrote: post #949
guerrilla wrote: post #824

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There's basically no consent with what Grok is doing. Wait how do you get consent from people that don't exist?

AI fake nudes were made from very real and very alive people

This part of the thread wasn't about that.

Re: X offices raided in France as UK opens fresh investigation into Grok

#957

Post by tyre »

justaboutanyone wrote: post #406
tyre wrote: post #403

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The merger was most likely now because they have to do it before the IPO. After the IPO, there’s a whole process to force independent evaluation and negotiation between two boards / executives, which would be an absolute dumpster fire where Musk controls both. When they’re both private, fine, whatever.

First thing a public spacex would want to do is sell off all the non-spacex crap

A public SpaceX will still be run by Musk. A public SpaceX would have to sell assets like X for a huge loss given its debt load, which would also take a propaganda machine out of Musk’s hands.

They’re stuck with those assets.

Re: X offices raided in France as UK opens fresh investigation into Grok

#958

Post by themafia »

themafia wrote: post #469
miki123211 wrote: post #454

This vindicates the pro-AI censorship crowd I guess. It definitely makes it clear what is expected of AI companies. Your users aren't responsible for what they use your model for, you are, so you'd better make sure your model can't ever be used for anything nefarious. If you can't do that without keeping the model closed and verifying everyone's identities... well, that's good for your profits I guess.

Holding corporations accountable for their profit streams is "censorship?" I wish they'd stop passing models trained on internet conversations and hoarded data as fit for any purpose. The world does not need to boil oceans for hallucinating chat bots at this particular point in history.

What would be censorship is if those same companies then brigaded forums and interfered with conversations and votes in an effort to try to hide their greed and criminality.

Not that this would _ever_ happen on Hacker News. :|

Re: X offices raided in France as UK opens fresh investigation into Grok

#959

Post by whatis991 »

datsci_est_2015 wrote: post #914
whatis991 wrote: post #704

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If X/Twitter was to be banned in the EU, and some of its citizens still wanted to access X/Twitter, let us say for the sake of getting alternative points of view on politics and news, would it be a good or a bad thing if accessing X/Twitter by IP was stopped? As in, a citizen of an EU country types x.com/CNN, because he or she wants to know the other side of some political issue between the EU and the USA, and he or…

I’m reminded of Lord Haw-Haw, an English-speaking Nazi propagandist during WW2 that garnered quite a bit of attention for his radio broadcasts. There’s an interesting tidbit that he gained quite a few listeners when he started releasing casualty information that the British government withheld to try to keep wartime-morale high. Lord Haw-Haw then tried to leverage that audience into a force of Nazi sympathy and a gen…

I would have thought that the Great Firewall of China would be a more obvious thing to be reminded of. Especially since there is no world war currently, yet, at least, and communication might help stop one.

Also, Godwin's law, strangely.

Re: X offices raided in France as UK opens fresh investigation into Grok

#960

Post by bhelkey »

direwolf20 wrote: post #659
miki123211 wrote: post #454

This vindicates the pro-AI censorship crowd I guess. It definitely makes it clear what is expected of AI companies. Your users aren't responsible for what they use your model for, you are, so you'd better make sure your model can't ever be used for anything nefarious. If you can't do that without keeping the model closed and verifying everyone's identities... well, that's good for your profits I guess.

It's not because it could generate CSAM. It's because when they found out it could generate CSAM, they didn't try to prevent that, they advertised it. Actual knowledge is a required compenent of many crimes.

> when they found out it could generate CSAM, they didn't try to prevent that, they advertised it.

Twitter publicly advertised it can create CSAM?

I have been off twitter for several years and I am open to being wrong here but that sounds unlikely.

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