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Ozempic is changing the foods Americans buy

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Re: Ozempic is changing the foods Americans buy

#951

Post by borroka »

solarmist wrote: post #909
borroka wrote: post #864

There is a mix of culture and food at play here. Most people, left to their own devices, without cultural pressure, are lazy, unproductive, and slovenly. We can see that with food: as soon as the shaming of people for being fat weakened, as it happened primarily in the US and then in the Western world at large, people started to indulge without guardrails. We can see that with clothing and appearance: people started…

Bullshit. We built a world that constantly exploits human limits, then act surprised when people hit them. No one has infinite willpower.

A most surprising remark.

Dressing with intention does not require any particular willpower, just some desire, intention, a bit of time, and a taste that may develop over time.

Avoiding doomscrolling is not that hard. The first few days are usually hard when we want to break a habit that's hanging around like a terrible smell, but after that, it is smooth sailing.

One can play victim not forever but for a long time: we have seen that in particular between 2010 and 2015, with people claiming to be abused by the most absurd things. But those abusers remain absurd, and the alleged victims--of food, social media, celebrities stealing their attention like a bully steals candy from a nerd-- pathetic.

Re: Ozempic is changing the foods Americans buy

#952

Post by borroka »

bean469 wrote: post #941
borroka wrote: post #864

There is a mix of culture and food at play here. Most people, left to their own devices, without cultural pressure, are lazy, unproductive, and slovenly. We can see that with food: as soon as the shaming of people for being fat weakened, as it happened primarily in the US and then in the Western world at large, people started to indulge without guardrails. We can see that with clothing and appearance: people started…

> We can see that with clothing and appearance: people started to dress slovenly, preferring comfort to being presentable and well-put together. I know a 21 year old dude who dresses like he's from the 50s, suit, hat and all. He looks extremely presentable and is the biggest compliment machine that I know!

I live in a beach town and dress almost always in trousers and sports coat, occasionally in a suit, sometimes casually in jeans and shirts and desert boots, but always with intention.

Well, what can I do? I am terribly vain and don't see myself going out in flip-flops when not at the beach.

Re: Ozempic is changing the foods Americans buy

#953

Post by Edman274 »

SpicyLemonZest wrote: post #720
Edman274 wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At what point does a demand for evidence come back around to making the requestor seem less like a prudent, rational truth seeker and more like someone with naive lack of personal, lived experience? Like, not a single soul will say "got evidence for that assertion?" when it's a news story about EA or Oracle or Adobe acquiring a company and people are predicting that the acquired product will be destroyed, and isolate…

It needs evidence that there's a general phenomenon of "hyperpalatable" food companies can search for, not just a latent property of how certain macronutrients balance in food. Otherwise, it's like proposing that public transit is pointless because car companies will somehow defeat it by making up more reasons to drive.

But that's what happened. I mean, it doesn't mean that proposing public transit is pointless, but if someone in 1930 heard about a trolley track being run in town and another person said "it's only a matter of time before the car companies try to sabotage mass transit", they would've been right. That's what actually happened.

Re: Ozempic is changing the foods Americans buy

#954

Post by mmooss »

sfn42 wrote: post #942
onefootincode wrote: post #940

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is a disease as in “your metabolism is slow” so you need to cut food even more. It is a disease as “you have problem with controlling your impulses and therefore crave food” Psychological diseases are not better or worse from psychical/metabolic ones. They are real, and for some of them we have or we develop medicine. Nobody is claiming that obesity can’t be a result of a disease, but under the hood it always ends…

Slow metabolism is a bit of a myth. By that I mean that it's not strictly wrong to say someone has a slow metabolism, but metabolism is an expression of your activity level so what you're really saying is the person is sedentary. If the person starts being more active their metabolism will necessarily increase. So, slow metabolism is not a disease, it's not a genetic disorder, it is simply a result of the fact that s…

What is all that based on?

Re: Ozempic is changing the foods Americans buy

#955

Post by mmooss »

indecisive_user wrote: post #920
mmooss wrote: post #899

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Always a fair request. I don't know it well enough or have time at the moment, but afaik it's the medical consensus: Obesity is a disease, (mostly) not a result of behavior. Eating less and/or more activity doesn't cure people; iirc bodies adjust to retain the same amount of fat, etc. under the new conditions.

Then how does ozempic, whose primary mechanism of action is to decrease appetite, work for obese people? Yes, your body will compensate somewhat for caloric deficit, and yes, when you gain enough fat mass your adipocytes will divide, creating more/stronger hunger signals that encourage weight gain moreso than someone who was never obese. But your body is not magic. If you feed it a sufficiently low amount of calories…

> Then how does ozempic, whose primary mechanism of action is to decrease appetite, work for obese people?

That is a very interesting question.

> your body is not magic.

But it is a complex, highly adaptable system. The simplistic formula of calorie input = output is highly misleading.

> If you feed it a sufficiently low amount of calories

Sure, if you starve yourself, you'll start transitioning to dust pretty soon.

Re: Ozempic is changing the foods Americans buy

#956

Post by mmooss »

sfn42 wrote: post #918
mmooss wrote: post #915

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What I said is commonplace if you look around.

Yeah, beliefs commonly held by people who would rather make excuses than improve their lives.

It's just baseless nonsense. Doctors and researchers say otherwise.

Re: Ozempic is changing the foods Americans buy

#957

Post by mmooss »

borroka wrote: post #864

There is a mix of culture and food at play here. Most people, left to their own devices, without cultural pressure, are lazy, unproductive, and slovenly. We can see that with food: as soon as the shaming of people for being fat weakened, as it happened primarily in the US and then in the Western world at large, people started to indulge without guardrails. We can see that with clothing and appearance: people started…

> Most people, left to their own devices, without cultural pressure, are lazy, unproductive, and slovenly.

I disagree strongly. I think most people do the best they can. When they are emotionally overwhelmed, they withdraw.

Doing things you dislike, such as dressing certain ways, is not slovenliness. Your opinion is meaningful only to you (and those who choose to share it), it's not a standard. Also, what data is there of a problem? When people started dressing more casually (which I guess is your objection), the economy boomed, freedom boomed, Silicon Valley - famously casual - boomed, etc.

We could say that your thinking is slovenly, too lazy to try to understand that others have very different thoughts, perspectives, and priorities which are just as valid as yours. Too lazy to try to look at evidence. Much easier to take the egocentric path and judge everyone else, and repeat misinformation that's appealing - and all especially easier when it's culturally enabled.

Re: Ozempic is changing the foods Americans buy

#958

Post by indecisive_user »

mmooss wrote: post #955
indecisive_user wrote: post #920

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then how does ozempic, whose primary mechanism of action is to decrease appetite, work for obese people? Yes, your body will compensate somewhat for caloric deficit, and yes, when you gain enough fat mass your adipocytes will divide, creating more/stronger hunger signals that encourage weight gain moreso than someone who was never obese. But your body is not magic. If you feed it a sufficiently low amount of calories…

> Then how does ozempic, whose primary mechanism of action is to decrease appetite, work for obese people? That is a very interesting question. > your body is not magic. But it is a complex, highly adaptable system. The simplistic formula of calorie input = output is highly misleading. > If you feed it a sufficiently low amount of calories Sure, if you starve yourself, you'll start transitioning to dust pretty soon.

Somewhere between obese and dust you'll eventually hit a healthy weight.

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC2495396/

Re: Ozempic is changing the foods Americans buy

#959

Post by mmooss »

borroka wrote: post #951
solarmist wrote: post #909

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bullshit. We built a world that constantly exploits human limits, then act surprised when people hit them. No one has infinite willpower.

A most surprising remark. Dressing with intention does not require any particular willpower, just some desire, intention, a bit of time, and a taste that may develop over time. Avoiding doomscrolling is not that hard. The first few days are usually hard when we want to break a habit that's hanging around like a terrible smell, but after that, it is smooth sailing. One can play victim not forever but for a long time:…

These are all empty claim, including a grand social theory. I'm not even sure what you're talking about for 2010-2015. You really need to be drowning in yourself to believe it all and then, on top of it, to judge other people.

People don't share your priorities or beliefs. Maybe that's why they act differently.

> Avoiding doomscrolling is not that hard.

If you mean addiction to social media, that's empirically not true. You can see how many people are addicted, and the research about it. Typing a few bytes into HN doesn't change or establish any facts.

Re: Ozempic is changing the foods Americans buy

#960

Post by kbelder »

nottorp wrote: post #826
joshocar wrote: post #792

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I also think there is an education gap. People grow up eating processed food and don't learn to cook. People often try to cook, but online recipes are not really teaching you anything and are often far more work than they need to be or turn out bad, so people think or learn that cooking a meal takes a long time, is a lot of work, and doesn't taste as good. Cooking becomes the exception rather than the norm. In realit…

I guess most online recipes assume you're cooking for "special occasions". I can buy a bag of frozen assorted veggies and a few pieces of frozen salmon in the store across the street, throw them 15 min into a pan and be done. It's mostly what I feed on. Not in the US though.

I haven't been in a place in the US where you can't easily do that, and I don't live in a particularly urban environment.
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