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Utah becomes first US state to ban fluoride in its water

bbc.com

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Re: Utah becomes first US state to ban fluoride in its water

#951

Post by oaktrout »

agentultra wrote: post #917
oaktrout wrote: post #890

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All the evidence in that article is based on what a politician thinks. "And I think another meta study came out also". The actual high quality evidence shows that water fluorination has minimal impact on tooth health in 2025: https://www.cochrane.org/news/water-fluoridation-less-effect...

I was thinking of this study: https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/cdoe.12215 Perhaps more could be done. The situation is complex because of several compounding factors for sure. There are European countries that have no water fluoridation and better oral health outcomes than in North America. Regardless, there’s 10 years where a city in North America turned off water fluoridation and we have results of…

I'm skimming the results, but it looks like adult teeth had less cavities when they turned the fluoride off...and that was not observed in Edmonton where they left the fluoride on the whole time.

"For all tooth surfaces among permanent teeth (Table 1a), there was a statistically significant decrease in Calgary, for the overall mean DMFS, which was not observed in Edmonton."

Based on their data, you could argue that fluoride increases cavities in adults... I'm not making that argument. I agree with you in that I think confounders are at play and the difference attributed to fluorinated water isn't as large.

People will use this study to take about the rampant tooth decay in Calgary, ignoring that there is roughly as much decay in Edmonton which had the fluoride on the whole time.

Re: Utah becomes first US state to ban fluoride in its water

#952

Post by refurb »

jclulow wrote: post #446
refurb wrote: post #433

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Canada does the opposite of America even if it hurts Canada - it’s a part of its identity. Redefining freedom as “forcing something on people for their own good” is not how anyone actually defines freedom. It’s like saying children have the most freedom because their parents force them to do things that will benefit them.

> Canada does the opposite of America even if it hurts Canada - it’s a part of its identity. As a duel citizen of the US and another Commonwealth nation, I have to say that this is exactly the ridiculous self-caricature perspective that gives foreign nationals a sort of combination of pity and contempt for the average US citizen. While it's true that your cartoonish portrayal of freedom is one possible interpretation…

> As a duel citizen of the US and another Commonwealth nation, I have to say that this is exactly the ridiculous self-caricature perspective that gives foreign nationals a sort of combination of pity and contempt for the average US citizen.

Ahh, you see there you made a mistake. I'm not American.

And your examples of "this is better" don't address the point I made - how Canadians identify themselves.

Re: Utah becomes first US state to ban fluoride in its water

#953

Post by sothatsit »

stevebmark wrote: post #856
sothatsit wrote: post #367

Fluoride in toothpaste already covers most people today. So, if there are legitimate concerns about adding it to the water supply due to fluorosis, even if those concerns are small, removing it seems reasonable to me. Are the number of people who don't brush their teeth really high enough to justify it?

Decades of science show it’s beneficial, and we keep seeing the outcomes validated in practice. Calgary removed fluoride from drinking water, saw a significant increase in dental carries in children, and is adding it back. [1] Hawaii does not fluoridate and has high rates of children’s tooth decay [2] [1] https://www.npr.org/2024/12/13/nx-s1-5224138/calgary-removed... [2] https://www.civilbeat.org/2016/10/hawaii-chil…

Thanks, that changes my view on this :)

Re: Utah becomes first US state to ban fluoride in its water

#954

Post by EasyMark »

codybontecou wrote: post #18

Hawaii does not add fluoride to their water. Utah may be the first to out-right ban it, but there are quite a few local communities and cities that opt-out of adding it to their drinking water. https://chatgpt.com/share/67e8572d-c5f4-8000-9393-c2e894c922...

It seems like they could compare states/countries/cities while controlling for other factors (age, income level, etc) to see how well fluoridation works. I'm pretty sure you'll find that fluoridation helps lower the number of cavities, but it's not going to be a slam dunk.

Re: Utah becomes first US state to ban fluoride in its water

#955

Post by EasyMark »

timeon wrote: post #76
elif wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fluoridation, imperial measurement, 20% tips, taxes added at the register, and circumcision are the weirdest things Americans think everyone does.

> 20% tips Is this real?

for some people it is. Maybe you'll become a believer when you realize that waiters wages are only around $2.35 an hour plus tips. Some states require that wait staff make -at least- federal minimum wage ($7.50? or so). Most do quite a bit better than that in all but the worst restaurant jobs. Not really a living wage tho. Some people do well on tips in upper crust restaurants, and often bartenders have enough turnover to do pretty well too.

Re: Utah becomes first US state to ban fluoride in its water

#956

Post by EasyMark »

elif wrote: post #672
timeon wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 20% tips Is this real?

I kid you not, majority of Americans (myself included) feel some level of guilt pushing the 15% button.

depends on where it's at. Sit down? I will always tip. Pickup up at the restaurant? nope.

Re: Utah becomes first US state to ban fluoride in its water

#957

Post by EasyMark »

mjevans wrote: post #102
lolinder wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, this is one of those places where because RFK Jr took the anti- stand there's an understandable assumption that it's more nutty anti-science stuff, but it's much less clear cut when it comes to fluoridation. Europe has much lower rates than the US, which is an outlier on these stats only approached by Australia, and before Utah the major high profile anti-fluoride stance was made by Portland: https://www.wweek.…

I'd be happier if that broken-but-correct-2x-a-day guy banned HFCS (High Fructose Corn Syrup) instead. It is my personal hypothesis that it is the cause of 'sugar cancer' (general cases of bad sugars / imbalances of sugars in the body), including Diabetes.

sugar is as bad for you as HFCS, avoid both except in small amounts. Your taste buds will adjust

Re: Utah becomes first US state to ban fluoride in its water

#958

Post by EasyMark »

fashion-at-cost wrote: post #146
mjevans wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd be happier if that broken-but-correct-2x-a-day guy banned HFCS (High Fructose Corn Syrup) instead. It is my personal hypothesis that it is the cause of 'sugar cancer' (general cases of bad sugars / imbalances of sugars in the body), including Diabetes.

Not a chance that will happen, given the corn production of America. We have the most productive land in the world for growing maize, and Lord knows we’ll find shit to do with it.

We grow lots of corn because it is very heavily subsidized and insured by the US government. At scale you are guaranteed to make a profit, even during bad weather years.

Re: Utah becomes first US state to ban fluoride in its water

#959

Post by EasyMark »

__alexs wrote: post #429
AndrewSwift wrote: post #404

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What does a white-tooth culture look like specifically? People brush their teeth in France, they have modern dentristy etc.

US people wear facades to hide their teeth.

*A significant minority of...

Re: Utah becomes first US state to ban fluoride in its water

#960

Post by EasyMark »

BeFlatXIII wrote: post #903
thayne wrote: post #208

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most places in Utah already don't add flouride to water. So why pass a law to ban it?

Virtue signaling.

this is it exactly. See west virginia recently banning artificial coloring. Because MAGA said so, is basically the reason, they were completely unworried about it before it became important to MAGA world by way of RFK
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