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Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

businessinsider.com

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Re: Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

#951

Post by Toutouxc »

SantiagoElf wrote: post #457

In my family - we have two cars - all Alfa Romeos. Alfa Romeo Stelvio 2018 / 2.0 petrol / 280 bhp Alfa Romeo Stelvio Quadrifoglio 2021 / 2.9 V6 / 510 bhp We have ZERO incentives to change these cars with electrics; why would I change my convenience to put gas in the established gas network with the dubious charging station availability (Eastern Europe)? I drove a Hyundai Kona electric last year; well, when you drive…

Honestly, there’s something very Eastern European about your comment. You own two unnecessarily powerful SUVs, driving waay over the speed limit in Bulgaria seems somehow relevant to you and you still wonder why you should be inconvenienced by EVs while ecosystems are dying left and right beyond any doubt. With this mindset you actually might be one of the last people to understand, yes.

Re: Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

#952

Post by rdtsc »

mikrotikker wrote: post #929
freddie_mercury wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is entirely because manufacturers thought they saw a way to pad margins and then US politicians added tariffs to Chinese EVs to protect them from lower-cost competition. As the other reply mentions, this isn't an issue in China. And now that the bet on expensive EV growth allowing manufacturers to have fat margins forever isn't panning out, they're all freaking out about cheap Chinese models and pivoting to desi…

The Chinese EVs are very unsafe. Many many fires are happening with them, but you don't see it reported due to the journalistic repression there. The sales numbers of Chinese EVs also look good because they'll buy hundreds of cars from their own stock and then park them in a field to rot, just to make the numbers look good. IMO there shouldn't be a tariff on Chinese EVs but an outright ban.

> The Chinese EVs are very unsafe. Many many fires are happening with them, but you don't see it reported due to the journalistic repression there.

Wonder if it's just carelessness, or it's there is an inherent cost to make them safe. As in, did they just not bother because of laziness, or that extra safety to prevent fires takes up the 2x-3x price markup and there is simply no way around it.

Re: Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

#953

Post by deviantbit »

mips_r4300i wrote: post #709
deviantbit wrote: post #224

"EV should be able to do everything a gas car can" I disagree with this article. I have a 2023 Polestar that I've had for about 10 months. I will be trading it when my new gasoline Audi arrives in the next week or so. I'll never have another electric vehicle. They tell you things that are not true. The cost of ownership of electric vehicles is much higher than gasoline, especially if you travel. It takes twice as lon…

How have your insurance rates compared?

A little, but I went from an Audi to the Polestar. Parts are easier to get for Audi. I don't think it being an EV is what caused the increase though.

Re: Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

#954

Post by vel0city »

iamleppert wrote: post #946
vel0city wrote: post #695

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I like the fact it takes a few minutes to refuel my car I guarantee you spend more time fueling your ICE than I do my EV in a given year.

Have you stopped to consider that I don’t have a garage? That many, many drivers don’t have a private garage and their own EV charger? Basically anyone who lives in a regular apartment doesn’t have a garage and thus can’t charge their car at night. If EVs are to succeed they need to work for the masses as good or better than what we have now. Not just your rich techie with a Tesla parked in their private garage in Pa…

Have you stopped to consider people outside of rich techies in Palo Alto also have garages?

Re: Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

#955

Post by deviantbit »

recursive wrote: post #758
deviantbit wrote: post #224

"EV should be able to do everything a gas car can" I disagree with this article. I have a 2023 Polestar that I've had for about 10 months. I will be trading it when my new gasoline Audi arrives in the next week or so. I'll never have another electric vehicle. They tell you things that are not true. The cost of ownership of electric vehicles is much higher than gasoline, especially if you travel. It takes twice as lon…

> A trip that used to take me normally 7 hours turned into 15 hours for charging and waiting. Interesting. For another data point, it turned a "normally" 12 hour trip into about 13.5 for me. (Sacramento to Seattle)

Try driving through Wyoming and Kansas. Enjoy.

What car do you have? Do you carry an adapter? How many times has it been stolen for you?

Re: Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

#956

Post by [deleted] »

recursive wrote: post #758
deviantbit wrote: post #224

"EV should be able to do everything a gas car can" I disagree with this article. I have a 2023 Polestar that I've had for about 10 months. I will be trading it when my new gasoline Audi arrives in the next week or so. I'll never have another electric vehicle. They tell you things that are not true. The cost of ownership of electric vehicles is much higher than gasoline, especially if you travel. It takes twice as lon…

> A trip that used to take me normally 7 hours turned into 15 hours for charging and waiting. Interesting. For another data point, it turned a "normally" 12 hour trip into about 13.5 for me. (Sacramento to Seattle)

[deleted]

Re: Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

#957

Post by _ea1k »

gottorf wrote: post #739
_ea1k wrote: post #675

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, EVs are most convenient for well over half the country. I'd say that we are nowhere near saturation. But reading the room leads me to believe that there are a lot of people in your target demographic who think that EVs are for city dwellers. The biggest issues for getting from 10% to ~50% are communication, price, and availability.

> The biggest issues for getting from 10% to ~50% are communication, price, and availability. I would simplify this down to just price. Price is a signaling mechanism in the market, which takes care of both communication and availability. Nobody would need to communicate the virtues of an EV if it's priced like a Toyota Corolla with sufficient range.

That last part is the problem. The "oh noes, it will take 4 hour stops to ... cccchhaarrrggeee" types need communication. They think it will take 1000 mile ranges to replace their Corolla.

You might not know if it you haven't seen the discussions with people who have 0 experience with EVs, but there's a ton of misinformation being actively spread.

Re: Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

#958

Post by freddie_mercury »

mikrotikker wrote: post #929
freddie_mercury wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is entirely because manufacturers thought they saw a way to pad margins and then US politicians added tariffs to Chinese EVs to protect them from lower-cost competition. As the other reply mentions, this isn't an issue in China. And now that the bet on expensive EV growth allowing manufacturers to have fat margins forever isn't panning out, they're all freaking out about cheap Chinese models and pivoting to desi…

The Chinese EVs are very unsafe. Many many fires are happening with them, but you don't see it reported due to the journalistic repression there. The sales numbers of Chinese EVs also look good because they'll buy hundreds of cars from their own stock and then park them in a field to rot, just to make the numbers look good. IMO there shouldn't be a tariff on Chinese EVs but an outright ban.

Why does there need to be a ban? Why isn't simply enforcing existing US safety standards sufficient?

Re: Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

#959

Post by fomine3 »

munificent wrote: post #887

> Niedermeyer said that while an electric car can meet most people's driving needs, it struggles with edge cases like road trips because of the need to recharge. Since Americans have been promised a one-to-one substitute for their gas cars, this seems like a failure; an EV should be able to do everything a gas car can. This idea persists even though in 2023 the average US driver traveled only about 40 miles a day, an…

Good point. Buying a car is both practical and impractical.

Re: Fewer people are buying electric cars in the US

#960

Post by recursive »

deviantbit wrote: post #955
recursive wrote: post #758

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> A trip that used to take me normally 7 hours turned into 15 hours for charging and waiting. Interesting. For another data point, it turned a "normally" 12 hour trip into about 13.5 for me. (Sacramento to Seattle)

Try driving through Wyoming and Kansas. Enjoy. What car do you have? Do you carry an adapter? How many times has it been stolen for you?

Ford Mach E. No adapter.

It will be a while before I can fit that road trip into my schedule.

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