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Teen mental health is plummeting and social media is a major contributing cause [pdf]

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Re: Teen mental health is plummeting and social media is a major contributing cause [pdf]

#951
post #576
post #258

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Idk but in France, when I was still a teenager, it was not that uncommon to talk/joke about the fact that we will never be able to retire. In high school, most of my classmate already started to have a political conscience and where thinking about this kind of stuff. Same with the environment. We already had social media at the time (mostly facebook) and yes, I won't deny that there was already something anxious abou…

Unfortunately, the way I've felt during my childhood, French schools don't teach critical thinking. Basically every student comes out of school saying exactly the same thing: more government, more power to the government, politicians, public services... Most schools are run by the government after all, and obviously governments will claim they need more power or society will decay. So from a young age students are ba…

What is the seven hell is this message ?

> I don't blame you, it's hard to stand across a tidal wave, especially when young. But how about standing out a bit from the herd once and think outside of the political box?

That's a lot of assumption about me from one comment. You don't know me, we never met nor discussed, you should refrain from talking to people that you don't know like that.

> Most schools are run by the government after all, and obviously governments will claim they need more power or society will decay.

This is far from true on many level. Also, the only class that talk about politic, society and such is teached in high school, when most teen already started to develop their own critical thinking, and is very short.

> So from a young age students are basically taught to give up their power if not their lives to authorities, to politics. It has to be politics, it can't come from the individual. So they don't care about freedom or personal sovereignty (that's evil), they ask for government, rules, laws and taxes like would seniors. And they call that protection, if not "progress".

What ?

I had a lot of friends who were anarchist and communist in high school and after. Unions and the french communist party were often coming to the high school giving literature to teens who would accept them. So no, a lot where not "asking for government". That and there was often student protest (blocus, when you block your high school).

And even then, what is wrong about asking, and fighting for, the government to improve ? The political class to improve ? What is your solution ? It's not like the government is going to go away. So what do you want ? Massive privatization ? We saw the result of such policies in many other country. Asking for public services and fighting for them to improve is not "asking the government", it is being involved and being able to think critically. Critical thinking is not about being a libertarian ancap.

You are just acting like a pedantic know-it-all making a lot of assumption about a whole class of people without making any meaningful proposition and insightful criticism.

Re: Teen mental health is plummeting and social media is a major contributing cause [pdf]

#952
post #756

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To add to your response to #2: kids are watching their parents behave poorly on social media, and spend their time with their noses in devices. When parents of older kids still have trouble "adulting," that is bound to trickle down to the kids. Certainly, I don't look like my dad did in his late 40s, but I also have a pretty firm grasp of the responsibilities I have. My kids also must avoid social media until they ar…

We also held out on smart phones until our kids were 15 / 17 respectively. You held out even longer, so kudos for being able to do that. Our kids weren't mocked. They didn't feel left out. They didn't even complain because they had never had a smart phone so they literally had no idea what they were missing out on - which is nothing. They missed out on nothing. In the end, we wanted a way to keep in touch with them a…

In the end, we wanted a way to keep in touch with them and see where they were as they began driving and working. That's NOT a healthy reason to get a kid a smartphone, BTW. That's just a reflection of my fear and insecurity.

Yep, I went through the same thing.

Re: Teen mental health is plummeting and social media is a major contributing cause [pdf]

#953

Unpopular opinion: Social media is a great scapegoat, but it is not the source of the problem. It is where they go to communicate and cope. My sole qualification to post this: I have four kids that are either teens or in their early 20s, and one who will be a teen next year. Here is what I see out there: 1. Kids have little or no slack in their schedule. This means very little freedom, and very little time to work th…

I like idea (1), where kids don’t have mental space to sort thoughts out. Although I disagree that most kids are too busy for it. It may be that habitual social media use decreases kids’ free time, as they use social media/their phone as soon as they’re free, rather than sit, think, and process thoughts.

I think this is also applicable to adults, although it’s effects could be less since smartphones weren’t prevalent when current adults were children.

Re: Teen mental health is plummeting and social media is a major contributing cause [pdf]

#954
post #938
post #798

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was emotionally and psychically abused in cub scouts, led by the pack leader because I did not buy into her specific image of evangelical Christianity. This was in a suburb outside of NYC in the 90s. the lack of oversight and vetting allowed this to proceed and turned more than a few kids off Boy scouting. I would send my kids to Baden-Powell scouting if that was an option.

I have a similar story about a crazy hyperchristian scout leader from suburban SE Michigan in the 90s. I ended up getting de-facto kicked out for my atheism.

Same. The scout leader took my parents aside and told them I was going to hell, and blah blah blah. That was the end of that.

Re: Teen mental health is plummeting and social media is a major contributing cause [pdf]

#955
post #798

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was emotionally and psychically abused in cub scouts, led by the pack leader because I did not buy into her specific image of evangelical Christianity. This was in a suburb outside of NYC in the 90s. the lack of oversight and vetting allowed this to proceed and turned more than a few kids off Boy scouting. I would send my kids to Baden-Powell scouting if that was an option.

Had a similar experience with Cub Scouts in the 70's. I just stopped going. Joined the Boy Scouts because I had several friends who'd joined and were talking about the awesome camping adventures they had. That went well until the Scoutmaster quit 2-3 years later for whatever reason. The new Scoutmaster wasn't into the high adventure camping and believed the troop should head another direction. That was the end for me…

I was never given the opportunity for the more exciting trips because I was not Christian enough.

Re: Teen mental health is plummeting and social media is a major contributing cause [pdf]

#956

IRC has been around for decades as have bulletin boards. IRC is real-time versus slower bulletin boards but are graphical. What is it with social media that is so different? I've used per-Internet BBS, IRC, bulletin boards and I feel the difference in social media. The closest I can come is chat rooms in games where there is a mix of anonymity, comradeship, contempt, bullying but all by people there to game. Social m…

The difference between social media and IRC / IM / fourms is the pervasiveness into all aspects of our lives. The older style communities were focused around specific topics / activites and what was done there didn't spread outside that specific community. Now anything we do is broadcast (& recorded) to anyone and everyone who might take an interest, now or in the future.

Yes that's true I was overlooking mobile phones with cameras and networking. At least before you could leave your desktop at home and go outside.

Re: Teen mental health is plummeting and social media is a major contributing cause [pdf]

#957

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’ll counter that with the caveat that my kids are grade 5 and younger. We’re very involved in school and other activities - my wife is a PTO president and long time member, I coach youth sports and other community type programs. The kids we have seen mostly don’t engage with social media directly. But the ones who transition from cute 5-6 year olds to problematic 10-12 year olds have a key common factor. Tablets. Yo…

> Through lawsuits and reporting, I learned that my childhood Boy Scout Troop and church was infested with pedophiles. It's really sad to see things like this. Boy Scouts was one of the best parts of my childhood. Both my parents were heavily involved - dad was the Scout Master, mom was the merit badge counselor for backpacking and other woodland activities, my younger sisters came on many of the trips. It served as…

It’s interesting how they don’t report with the same enthusiasm how prevalent sexual abuse and harassment is in schools: https://www.washingtonpost.com/education/2020/10/15/sexual-a...

Re: Teen mental health is plummeting and social media is a major contributing cause [pdf]

#958
post #933

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The internet was certainly a lot lower stakes and fun in the 90s and early 2000s. We had fun taking over the mic and singing karaoke in Yahoo chatrooms, watching albino black sheep, and playing flash games on kongregator. Even early Facebook was just making funny groups and posting in each other's walls. None of those activities really had me envying anyone else. I remember the first thing that made me feel worthless…

I think you underline the problem. Comparing yourself with others and envying is a source of unhappiness. Social media allows for this, as do TED talks. But I think another factor is the sheer existence of our ancestors. As more time goes on, the more history there is with more people having achieved great accomplishments. Younger generations will naturally just have more to live up to (with the potential to feel dep…

So we must all change our concept of “greatness”. Perhaps more effort to embrace and value what is considered “less” rather than always trying to level up.

Re: Teen mental health is plummeting and social media is a major contributing cause [pdf]

#959

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is the matter of proportionality. There are challenges and problems, some worse than prior generations and some better. Putting the comparison aside. It is not healthy or helpful to teach children that they are doomed, the situation is hopeless, and their their future is destined to be miserable. I wouldn't tell my child "your life will suck, and you would be better off dead" every morning when they wake up. Pe…

Children aren't being directly told these things. They are seeing it every day on blast from every source of media. It's not just kids. Its young adults choosing not to get married or have kids. The reality is grim. Progress is relative. Even if the young generation isn't that bad compared to the 1700s, it's bad compared to what it could directly be related to, which is the previous generation and the era of good and…

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Re: Teen mental health is plummeting and social media is a major contributing cause [pdf]

#960
post #497

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The article makes a strong claim, based on evidence, that social media and not anything else is the real culprit. Why is it wrong? What evidence supports your alternative proposed causes?

The author mentions in his testimony, that the correlation between social media use and mental illness may be around r=0.10. This means in general terms that it it explains about 10% of of the impact. This leaves a lot of room for additional factors, and factors with much greater impact.

Actually it explains 1% of the impact, since the R-squared will be 0.01. But there's a huge amount of random noise in whether people get depressed, which we would always struggle to explain. A measure of the effect size is more interesting than a measure of R^2.
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