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Time to Take a Stand

blog.samaltman.com

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Re: Time to Take a Stand

#951

Post by zo1 »

catawbasam wrote: post #701
beejiu wrote: post #616

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is how it should be in principle. In this case, the problem is not the political system, it is the politics. (In other words, you get what you vote for.)

Except I didn't. Neither did a majority of my fellow voters.

Then secede? Have a majority referendum in your respective states about it and tell us how it goes. Either that or admit that part of being part of the union is agreeing with the electoral college and the outcomes that arise from it.

As much as I think that the majority Democrat States should suck it up about losing the election, I also think it's fully within their rights to secede if their populace wishes.

Re: Time to Take a Stand

#952

Post by scrollaway »

hsod wrote: post #933
scrollaway wrote: post #329

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You focus so much on holding people accountable rather than prevention. Lay off seeking justice for a while, try to seek order instead. Listen to why people voted Trump rather than call them all bigots and justify it with "they knew what they were getting into". As a european who truly despises Trump: This idea that you're too busy blaming people for being racist to spend time listening to them is honestly frightenin…

Your comment is eerily reminiscent of this quote from MLK's Letter From Birmingham Jail: "I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro's great stumbling block in the stride toward freedom is not the White Citizen's Council-er or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate who is more devoted to "order" than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace…

And your comment is truly repulsive.

I have been fighting this for a year, far better with plain discussion than anyone I've seen with sticks and this isn't even my country. Your implications are disgusting and the nicest way I can find to tell it to you is to stuff it.

What I said in my comment (I'm guessing you were too busy looking for that quote instead of reading mine more carefully) is that focusing on holding people accountable is no good.

It will NOT bring you Clinton, Sanders or anyone else back and it will certainly NOT change people's minds.

It's fucking enraging that you do not understand that. I swear, some people here are pettier than Trump himself.

Re: Time to Take a Stand

#953

Post by koliber »

ebfd wrote: post #886
koliber wrote: post #798

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am curious what your ethnicity is. At what point did you ancestors arrive in the United States, or are you perhaps an immigrant yourself? Did any of your ancestors, at any point, belong to a group of immigrants that was considered by a portion of the US populace as "undesirable", but were let in nonetheless? Would you consider your own presence in the United States as a benefit of such immigration which took place…

I'm ethnically European, so my ancestors shared the same race and values as the demography of the United States at the time. More so, the country at that time did not strive to provide government funded food, shelter, or healthcare, so no financial burden was required to support them. I don't think it would have benefited, say, Israel or Japan to have extended my ancestors citizenship.

Which part of Europe? Polish, Italian, German, and Irish immigrants at one point or another were frowned upon.

Re: Time to Take a Stand

#955

Post by vedranm »

thedevil wrote: post #412
disantlor wrote: post #335

Earlier quoted context omitted.

why are we giving so much benefit of the doubt to trump and trumps supporters not only is this move ridiculous but it was executed with no foresight. now border agents are forced to make ad hoc decisions because it went into effect immediately. trump supporters cheering and claiming its just temporary, to give us time to "figure out whats going on" are deluding themselves. they rush through a ridiculous, anti-america…

Well, we definitely should not pander to them. I actually think most people (Trump supporters, you, me, everyone) vote mostly based on identity (liberal/conservative, religion, race, open-minded, well-mannered, etc). I think Trump supporters mostly voted for the party that they most identified with, the guy they thought was on their side. And I think you did the same. (I see myself as unaligned and open-minded, thus…

Trump supporter here. Unfortunately not a citizen, so I couldn't vote. I believe, as do many people in the world, that US Presidential Election is worth following due to the influence that USA has on the rest of the world.

You are right about the ideology being very important. I originally supported Rand Paul [1] and moved to Trump when Paul dropped out. I wish either Ron Paul or Rand Paul would be the nominee of GOP and sincerely believe that is the purest form of Republicanism that currently exists out there. I support both the ideology and the priorities that both of them are pushing. However, since we couldn't get Rand Paul, Trump was the next best choice this season.

I can't stand any of the Democrats right now. I wish they instead nominated someone like Elon Musk, who would cut on identity politics, political correctness and similar things that are being pushed so hard to divide us instead of uniting us; e pluribus unum. I would like to see a future nominee focus on the scientific and technological development, abolishment or at least a reform of the patent system, ending NSA spying, etc.

[1] https://randpaul.com/issues

Re: Time to Take a Stand

#956

Post by m_fayer »

maxnevermind wrote: post #693
m_fayer wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm already seeing this in Berlin. I know multiple engineers and academics who have abandoned career moves to the US because they "don't want to live in such a toxic environment."

I'm thinking about moving to Berlin, but a million of illegal economic migrants from middle east in Germany and Trump policy in the US regarding them make US much more attractive option

As an American living between Berlin and NYC for 7 years now, here's how it feels to me: The migrants in Germany have created some tension and isolated incidents, but the political and interpersonal climate is the US is significantly more toxic. Even though per capita the US is taking way less migrants than Germany is.

Re: Time to Take a Stand

#957

Post by [deleted] »

maxnevermind wrote: post #693
m_fayer wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm already seeing this in Berlin. I know multiple engineers and academics who have abandoned career moves to the US because they "don't want to live in such a toxic environment."

I'm thinking about moving to Berlin, but a million of illegal economic migrants from middle east in Germany and Trump policy in the US regarding them make US much more attractive option

[deleted]

Re: Time to Take a Stand

#958

Post by [deleted] »

pfarnsworth wrote: post #654
wcummings wrote: post #285

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Democrats are just as bad as the Republicans. This false equivalence convinced people to vote for Trump. No way Hillary would have implemented this ban.

You are completely incorrect. Empirically, the country voted with a nearly 50/50 split between the two candidates, meaning the country felt both candidates were "just as bad". Just because you have your own personal biases doesn't actually make them right, the data does.

[deleted]

Re: Time to Take a Stand

#959

Post by [deleted] »

pfarnsworth wrote: post #765
becarefulyo wrote: post #712

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Empirically, it wasn't 50/50, not even among the percentage of the population that actually voted.

That's pretty disingenuous. For the purpose of my argument, 48/46 is close enough to 50/50 to make my point that it was close to split.

[deleted]

Re: Time to Take a Stand

#960

Post by wcummings »

pfarnsworth wrote: post #654
wcummings wrote: post #285

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Democrats are just as bad as the Republicans. This false equivalence convinced people to vote for Trump. No way Hillary would have implemented this ban.

You are completely incorrect. Empirically, the country voted with a nearly 50/50 split between the two candidates, meaning the country felt both candidates were "just as bad". Just because you have your own personal biases doesn't actually make them right, the data does.

Just because a lot of people "felt" something doesn't make it true.
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