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GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart

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Re: GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart

#951

Post by headhuntermdk »

jmorphy88 wrote: post #929
headhuntermdk wrote: post #917

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right. Fucking. There. Let me guess, you are a white male tired of people bringing up diversity? Or maybe you have forgotten about the special status given to minorities that brings us to todays topic? If enough was done, we wouldn't be having this conversation. As if "whitey" hasn't been shaking down different groups over the years.

It's clear that the diversiteers doesn't ever intend to define what constitutes "doing enough", and why would they? We keep falling for it. As for whitey shaking down other groups, so what? That's how the world works... shake or be shaken. I realize this is a topic that brings out a lot of emotions and moralizing in people, but it really is that simple...

People aren't robots so meritocracy is a pipe dream. Everyone has biases (just different ones). And if that's how the world works, then why the criticism of "whitey" being shaken down? Your post smacks of "don't hate the player, hate the game" kind of reasoning. Another word for this is "Supremacy" or "Entitlement". A black candidate doesn't get the job so maybe he or she isn't qualified, but as soon as the tables are turned for a white candidate, then all hell breaks loose.

In an ideal setting, the best candidate gets the job. But who is the best candidate? The black guy who doesn't live in the bay area, with no formal education but had to self teach himself programming because he couldn't afford to go to school? Or the recent Stanford grad that is more likely a culture fit (looks and sounds like the interviewer) with the grades but not the real world experience (yet)?

Re: GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart

#952

Post by kannonboy »

morgante wrote: post #124

Serious question: why can't someone make a good Github replacement that is anywhere near feature parity? I've tried both Bitbucket and GitLab, but their UIs continue to be leagues behind Github. It takes twice as long to do something in them (ex. find and blame a file) than it does with Github. If they could just get the UI right, I'd migrate in a second. Hosting providers should enforce political opinions (beyond de…

I realize it was just an example, but in Bitbucket you can hit 'f' on the file view, type part of a filename, select it and hit blame.

I'm a dev attached to the Bitbucket team and we're pretty proud of our design, and always looking for ways to streamline the UX. Are there any other operations that you find cumbersome or unintuitive?

Re: GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart

#953

Post by kannonboy »

icefox wrote: post #58
techdragon wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Shame they lack any way to discover active forks that is as useful as the GitHub network graph widget.

Using the API you can get it, they just don't bother showing it to the user.

Dev attached to the Bitbucket team here. While we love and support open source where we can, the vast majority of repositories on Bitbucket are private or public but maintained by a single organization. Our core focus is professional teams, which typically means branching (rather than forking) workflows. This has lead us to prioritize features like branch level permissions over network graphs and other features focused on forking workflows, because they are of higher value to our users. We're not ideologically opposed to them (indeed, forks are useful for some professional workflows too - such as working with contractors or external contributors), but they just haven't bubbled up to the top of our roadmap just yet.

Re: GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart

#954

Post by kannonboy »

morgante wrote: post #650
sauere wrote: post #491

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is not about the software. Github has become the number one place to show of your portfolio. Half of job postings these days encourage you to include a link to your GitHub profile.

> It is not about the software. For me, it emphatically is about the software. Even for totally private repos, where popularity is not a factor, I continue to turn to Github because the UIs for both Bitbucket and GitLab continue to stand in the way of me easily getting shit done.

I hate to take impinge on your good nature, but you gave such good feedback to sytse I have to ask: what's getting in your way with Bitbucket? As a product company we're pretty focused on UX and spend a lot of time getting it right, so I'd love to hear any suggestions on how we can streamline it!

(I'm one of the founding engineers on Bitbucket Server, but more involved in Bitbucket.org these days)

Re: GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart

#955

Post by jmorphy88 »

headhuntermdk wrote: post #951
jmorphy88 wrote: post #929

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's clear that the diversiteers doesn't ever intend to define what constitutes "doing enough", and why would they? We keep falling for it. As for whitey shaking down other groups, so what? That's how the world works... shake or be shaken. I realize this is a topic that brings out a lot of emotions and moralizing in people, but it really is that simple...

People aren't robots so meritocracy is a pipe dream. Everyone has biases (just different ones). And if that's how the world works, then why the criticism of "whitey" being shaken down? Your post smacks of "don't hate the player, hate the game" kind of reasoning. Another word for this is "Supremacy" or "Entitlement". A black candidate doesn't get the job so maybe he or she isn't qualified, but as soon as the tables ar…

> And if that's how the world works, then why the criticism of "whitey" being shaken down?

I'm not criticizing it per se. I'm trying to describe Diversity Inc. as a much simpler phenomenon than it's being made out to be. It's a battle between two groups with a conflict of interests, and one of those groups isn't even taking its own side in the fight. It sounds simplistic, but without an understanding of the basic political dynamics at work, there's not much use bickering over the details.

As for who is the "best" candidate for a given role, I didn't comment on that, but human interactions and group dynamics are highly complex phenomena. The problem as you described it may turn out to be unsolvable. This raises the question of who exactly benefits from these futile attempts to solve it. See above.

Re: GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart

#956

Post by kannonboy »

mikegioia wrote: post #575
tehbeard wrote: post #318

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why avoid Bitbucket? We switched to it from github at work and haven't encountered any major issues.

For us it was a combination of things. It was never really service/uptime related, but I can't count the number of in-app Javascript errors or weird UI decisions they made. The issues were just not good enough and the web pages were continually slow/bloated to load. Every time I'd open a support ticket I felt like I was a second-class citizen or that the issue I raised wasn't important to them. Continual, multiple ye…

Bitbucket dev here, I am truly sorry to hear that Mike. I've been an Atlassian for almost a decade and "legendary support" has always been something that we've prided ourselves on, so it hurts to hear about your experience! I'm not sure how long it's been, but things have hopefully improved since last time you checked out Bitbucket - the unification of Bitbucket.org with Bitbucket Server (née Stash) has meant a lot of refurbishment of the front-end code, much of which is now common across products. Our front-end and design teams have grown a lot more muscle too. If you have any specific feedback about the UI/UX I'd love to pass it on to the team.

Re: GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart

#957

Post by etherael »

Cancelled my subscription as soon as I read the tweet from @_danilo. If the races and genders were switched and the context instead was some horrendous civil war in Africa, it would be outrage fodder in the mainstream media for weeks, but because it's white males, it's totally alright to claim they're not just devoid of empathy and compassion, but constitutionally incapable of ever acquiring it.

My disgust is boundless. To hell with anyone that thinks and behaves like this.

Re: GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart

#958

Post by cookiecaper »

greenrd wrote: post #879
gaur wrote: post #850

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> At the time Eich made that donation, every major Democratic presidential candidate (including Clinton and Obama) were ALSO publicly opposed to marriage equality. So it seemed like extreme mental gymnastics to put a "hate speech" label on Eich. No, the extreme mental gymnastics here involve thinking that hate speech can be defined by looking at the content of Clinton and Obama's campaign speeches. The ouster came si…

He was on the wrong side of history, but your last sentence was unnecessary and over-the-top. He wasn't hired as a CEO, he was promoted into it. Before he became CEO, his political donations would not necessarily have been a concern.

>He was on the wrong side of history

Does the last 6 months count as history? I don't think enough time has elapsed to fully ascertain the merits of same-sex marriage. Changes in sexual culture take a few dozen years to propagate and get a good read on the real effects.

Re: GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart

#959

Post by cookiecaper »

anonicode wrote: post #928
victor9000 wrote: post #72

> While their efforts are admirable it is very hard to even interview people who are 'white' which makes things challenging How is this even legal? Change 'white' for any other race, and you'd have yourself a workplace discrimination lawsuit.

This isn't true of GitHub as a whole, and I'm not sure it is true of any part of GitHub. Their team page shows everybody on staff in the order they were hired. Scroll to the bottom and you will see that there is no shortage of white people being hired. https://github.com/about/team

Is that up to date? They used to introduce each employee on their blog but they hadn't done one for months last time I checked.

Re: GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart

#960

Post by aws_ls »

StevePerkins wrote: post #338

Some random thoughts and observations after reading this thread: [1] I'm interested in the differences between reactions to this, versus Brendan Eich's gay marriage scandal at Mozilla a couple of years ago. Don't get me wrong... I supported marriage equality then, and I do not support the worst of the statements called out in this story now. However, there are rational arguments that the HN community overreacted in B…

Sometime back when I moved from svn to git. My default choice was Github. But their pricing was a hindrance. I guess, its more suited for US (or countries with value-equivalence with USD). 7 USD per user, did not make any sense to me, from India. So I went with AWS CodeCommit. And my experience has been good. Finally how bad can any service which uses Git (done by Linus Torvalds) can be?

I also did not understand the big hoopla. If you can open source your project, then its good for you (free!). But they depend on enterprise and potentially other businesses with private code. But then it really does not make as much sense - as in whats the real gain - most of the use cases are from command line doing git [clone/pull/push].

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