Live data from Hacker News

Sam Altman may control our future – can he be trusted?

newyorker.com

941–950 of 1001 posts

Re: Sam Altman may control our future – can he be trusted?

#941
post #913

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I think sometimes you have to look at the patterns rather than at the single claim. If a large amount of people, that are completely unrelated, tell you very similar experiences they had with Altman, you can take that as a good indicator of his general character. Yes, but that doesn't work if you look for patterns selectively. There are large amount of people who will tell you vastly different experiences that they…

Sorry I didn't mean that the artice has proofs he lied, just that some of the situations presented cannot be simple misunderstandings. The pieces in the article I was referring to are: > Amodei’s notes describe escalating tense encounters, including one, months later, in which Altman summoned him and his sister, Daniela, who worked in safety and policy at the company, to tell them that he had it on “good authority” f…

That's interesting, I'm sure when I read the article it didn't specifically attribute those claims to Amodei.

To be frank, While I tend to think that Dario has good intentions, I'm not so sure about his judgement. He's made a lot of claims that haven't panned out. I haven't felt that it was due to dishonesty, but more because of hyperbole.

The phrasing "Altman then denied having made the claim. “I didn’t even say that,” he said. “You just said that,” Daniela replied." is very close to the pattern I described above where someone interprets a claim as something different from what was actually said and refuses to back down. Furthermore this was prefaced with "As one person briefed on the exchange recalled" so it isn't even a first hand account. We don't know who the person doing the briefing was, but if it was one of the participants of the exchange, they would have been afforded the opportunity to reframe it to put themselves in a better light.

The second claim is potentially even more of a match for the example I gave regarding people misreading legal documentation. Was this a denial about the existence of words in a document, or was it a denial that the words represented the provision that was claimed. I have seen people do this, they take the existence of the words as proof of their interpretation and take dismissal of the interpretation as a claim that the words do not exist. I don't rightly know why people do this, but I have seen it happen. I suspect you could find an abundant supply of cases like this from the records of the worlds town council meetings.

It is difficult to assess the reliability of claims made by the current administration (understating it somewhat), but one of the things that was said about the Government negotiations with Anthropic was that he wanted a gate to some AI abilities in national security circumstance by requiring a personal phone call to Amodei to clear it. No sane government on earth would agree to something like that. It would be an invitation to providing a corporate interest a massive point of leverage in a time of crisis.

But again I am in a similar position with Amodei. I don't have any direct knowledge of the person so I will reserve judgement. I generally like the approach Anthropic is taking but the exposure I have had to the statements made by Amodei himself has given me pause. I would not condemn him either, but I also wouldn't place a lot of stock in what he says unless I see more to create a more complete view of his character.

You note amount of people interviewed and their very similar experiences but it's the nature of how those claims are similar that concerns me. So many of the claims seem to fall into the pattern that requires the person reporting the claim to judge the sole meaning of what was said. How many confirmed direct quotes have been confirmed to be untrue? I'm open to the evidence, perhaps this article will draw some out, but right now I see people convincing themselves of a pattern and then interpreting their own experiences in terms of that pattern.

The thing is, if you were to ask, I think Altman would agree that he shouldn't be in charge of the world's AI. I don't think any one person should, and I would treat anyone who claimed that they were the right person for that job with massive suspicion. To say that's where he sits is to buy into the premise that whoever is the head of OpenAI controls our future. OpenAI is but one of many enterprises working on this, there are a lot of people claiming they already have lost too much ground, but then there have been many predicting their imminent collapse, like a doomsday cult rolling forward the calendar whenever it doesn't happen.

Re: Sam Altman may control our future – can he be trusted?

#943

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not fraud, and it's not sustainable. They aren't going to just keep doing that. It only makes sense if an AI company wants to pay for GPUs with stock, and - more importantly - the GPU company agrees to sell in exchange for stock.

s/fraud/corrupt, illegal $something. If you're picking on my vocabulary, that's fair. Fraud wasn't the point, I think you're smart enough to realize that.

I appreciate the implication that either you're right or I'm stupid, but maybe you should write the comment you meant to write.

Trading shares for GPUs is not corrupt either.

Re: Sam Altman may control our future – can he be trusted?

#944
post #839

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem with Altman isn't that he's "furthering his own interests". It's the deceitful behaviour he employs in the process.

There’s been enough divergence between words and actions from Amodei for me to also consider him deceitful, if that’s really the low bar you want to set. I’m not saying he’s worse than Altman, just to be clear.

Could you give some examples? It'd have to be pretty bad to get close to the reports about Altman.

Re: Sam Altman may control our future – can he be trusted?

#946
post #411
post #397

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, it's hard to tell sometimes but I've at least learned not to automatically take these personally. Well, partly learned. I don't think anyone familiar with this community would assume positive bias towards Sam, Airbnb, or even YC anymore - it's quite the contrary, from my perspective, but of course everyone notices different things and has their own view. Ditto for political slants.

I dont assume positive bias, but I do assume that most negative things that get people irked are removed as a result of the mechanics of the flagging system. Like, I dont really expect puff pieces for ycombinator or the like to get artificially pushed to the top, but I do expect that enough people who are feel culturally or financially invested in ycombinator to flag negative things into oblivion, especially as its c…

[deleted]

Re: Sam Altman may control our future – can he be trusted?

#947

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is it that criticism of people's insatiable greed for wealth and power often gets dismissed with this thought-terminating cliche about utopias? Desire to live in a society that's less greedy, that rewards compassion and punishes sociopathy is completely valid. We should be pursuing that earnestly because survival of our species depends on it. The people in charge are so drunk on wealth and power that they would r…

The criticism is not of the idea that the world has problems, and that we should look at those problems with the aim of fixing them. The criticism is of the assumption that a world without problems theoretically could exist. You may disagree, but you will not find a definition of such a world that everyone can agree on. Regardless, of whether you agree (that such a definition doesn't exist) or not, if you do plan on…

[deleted]

Re: Sam Altman may control our future – can he be trusted?

#948
post #932
post #892

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What kind of situation would I choose to use the word presents in that context without being aware of that fact? I am also aware that sincere people present that way. I don't believe there is any rational way to consider the appearance of innocence as evidence of guilt.

There is a ton of evidence out there that points to guilt. No one implied the appearance of innocence was evidence of guilt (as much as I admire the creativity in your interpretation, Mr. Self-Described Altman Apologist).

Making a selective quote the way you did with the response you provided made my interpretation reasonable.

What other point could you have been making? You made no reference to any other evidence.

>as much as I admire the creativity in your interpretation, Mr. Self-Described Altman Apologist).

I am unsure if this is deliberate irony, or poor comprehension.

Re: Sam Altman may control our future – can he be trusted?

#949
post #927

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

maybe white teenaged ("military aged") males should stop shooting up American schools. you see hoe your argument is bigoted?

It's bigoted to observe white teenaged males shoot up American schools at a frequency unprecedented worldwide? Oh well then

Re: Sam Altman may control our future – can he be trusted?

#950
Everybody on HN be handing over their thinking and right to indenpendent compute for some AI speed, quick money gains and fearmongering to big tech.

Even after the uncountable shady things about big tech, people just fall for that convenience left and right. Paying $200/mo to outsource my thinking skill to some rent seeking cartel that steals and is territorial is wild

Post reply on HN