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The struggle of resizing windows on macOS Tahoe

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Re: The struggle of resizing windows on macOS Tahoe

#941

Post by AnthonBerg »

bborud wrote: post #721
signal11 wrote: post #9

Tahoe is a macOS mis-step on par with Windows 8 or Windows Vista. If you’re from Apple and reading this, my feedback is pretty succinct: “I don’t recommend others upgrade. I wish I didn’t.” Luckily for Apple, Windows 11 is not exactly in a position to attract switchers. Let’s see if Apple can turn things around. iOS 8+ did improve on iOS 7’s worst bits.

I don't understand why Apple change things needlessly. What other purpose does it serve? How does this positively affect the bottom line? How does it improve life for Apple's users? Breaking basic interaction with windows purely because someone feels we should waste more screen real-estate on ornamentation by having bigger radius rounded corners is, for lack of a better word, stupid. I'd like Apple to focus more on t…

Managers are incentivized to do things to the real world that show up as "• Led implementation of [bla]" on their resume.

It's more effort to do things that also make sense than only to produce the bullet point.

Re: The struggle of resizing windows on macOS Tahoe

#942

Post by bborud »

enaaem wrote: post #858
bborud wrote: post #721

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand why Apple change things needlessly. What other purpose does it serve? How does this positively affect the bottom line? How does it improve life for Apple's users? Breaking basic interaction with windows purely because someone feels we should waste more screen real-estate on ornamentation by having bigger radius rounded corners is, for lack of a better word, stupid. I'd like Apple to focus more on t…

Good design should be timeless. For example, I like wat Leica did for their M serie cameras. At a certain point they decided that the design was done, and stopped messing around. For that you need leadership with good taste, because designers will always design.

Mostly, but they made mistakes too. Just look at the M5 vs the M6 vs the M7. The original M6 came out in 1984 and it is still the preferred model to this day in terms of film cameras. The M5 was too large and the M7 was too «electronic». People preferred the cameras that stuck closer to the original DNA. M6 cameras still fetch a pretty penny today. (So much so that Leica made a reissue a few years ago).

Re: The struggle of resizing windows on macOS Tahoe

#943

Post by bborud »

dillydogg wrote: post #740
renegade-otter wrote: post #736

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There has to be work done. Each sprint, new FEATURES must be completed. Features, people, FEATURES.

We finally have processors in our pockets that can calculate the pretty lights and colors, so make them calculate, people!

I’d like to use that extra processing and efficiency to get longer battery life when the phone isn’t doing anything special, and to have better performing apps.

Re: The struggle of resizing windows on macOS Tahoe

#944

Post by nrvn »

The whole article is tongue in cheek. And I struggle to find any comment here that would actually verify and confirm (or not) the results of the author.

So here I am, random hacker news links verifier.

Scrolling to the image below "So, for example, grabbing it here does not work:" text and reproducing the issue with a small caveat: just moving cursor 1 (ONE) pixel right turns the cursor into the "diagonal resizing mode" cursor. Overall, the resizing area of the window corner is comfortably bigger than the author draws. Dragging empty space outside the rounded corner is weird but what isn't in today's user interface designs?

All in all have never experienced difficulties resizing windows in macos.

Miss the times of windows 95/98 and macos 9 (as some other commenters here) when OS UI was designed by humans and for humans and everything was explicitly clear including the area for window resizing.

Re: The struggle of resizing windows on macOS Tahoe

#945

Post by spinningarrow »

nrvn wrote: post #944

The whole article is tongue in cheek. And I struggle to find any comment here that would actually verify and confirm (or not) the results of the author. So here I am, random hacker news links verifier. Scrolling to the image below "So, for example, grabbing it here does not work:" text and reproducing the issue with a small caveat: just moving cursor 1 (ONE) pixel right turns the cursor into the "diagonal resizing mo…

I agree with this. I was curious and tried it out just now - there's a good part of the inside corner that is draggable and a decent amount outside as well. The cursor changes to indicate resizability make it quite difficult for me to make a mistake here.

Re: The struggle of resizing windows on macOS Tahoe

#946

Post by LevkaDev »

I've spent months building a proper window manager for macOS, and the fundamental problem isn't the UI — it's that macOS has no proper window management API.

Third-party apps have to use the Accessibility API, which was designed for screen readers, not window manipulation. Some windows simply refuse to be resized below certain thresholds, and there's no way to query the minimum size in advance. You request 500px width, get 800px back, no error.

The real question is: will Apple ever provide a proper public API, or will this remain a cat-and-mouse game with Accessibility permissions?

Re: The struggle of resizing windows on macOS Tahoe

#947

Post by EagnaIonat »

blell wrote: post #559
EagnaIonat wrote: post #496

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The removal of Launchpad was an inexplicable blunder. It wasn't a blunder. It was absolutely intentional to force users to start using the AI component. I suspect someone probably pointed out no one would use it because launchpad has a better UX, so they removed it and forced the three finger pinch to launch spotlight. I'm currently using the following to fix it. - Bug in preferences that disabling show home also d…

What AI component?

Spotlight is used to train ML models on Apples servers. There is no private information used and they go through a process to remove PII information.

Re: The struggle of resizing windows on macOS Tahoe

#948

Post by oneeyedpigeon »

fluoridation wrote: post #924
oneeyedpigeon wrote: post #725

Something that baffles me about macOS: the pointer bug. I’ve been aware of this for ages—as far as I can recall, since Snow Leopard; maybe others have insight—and it still hasn't been fixed. Simply put: the pointer doesn't always switch context properly. So, you'll have it hovered over a resize control and it will refuse to change from the default pointer. Or you'll be working, and suddenly notice the pointer is a 'd…

This is Windows, but it might shed some light on the situation. I have a Qt application that I made, and occasionally when I switch from one window to another, the cursor doesn't switch from resize to normal, or vice versa, until I move the mouse. The precise effect is consistent, but difficult to describe, hence why the "sometimes". I think it happens because I'm not handling the window switch event as one that may…

Absolutely, I've always suspected that it's something to do with that. There's also something about the underlying tech that makes the macOS pointer behave 'more independently' of the rest of the UI, like it's running in a separate thread? I've definitely noticed scenarios in the past that would 'block' the pointer from updating (even its position) on Windows, that wouldn't on Mac.

So maybe the pointer is not as tightly-coupled to the underlying UI components, so some scenarios can cause them to briefly lose track of each other?

Re: The struggle of resizing windows on macOS Tahoe

#949

Post by 72deluxe »

signal11 wrote: post #9

Tahoe is a macOS mis-step on par with Windows 8 or Windows Vista. If you’re from Apple and reading this, my feedback is pretty succinct: “I don’t recommend others upgrade. I wish I didn’t.” Luckily for Apple, Windows 11 is not exactly in a position to attract switchers. Let’s see if Apple can turn things around. iOS 8+ did improve on iOS 7’s worst bits.

I wonder if they'll show charts of how few people have upgraded in the same way they mocked Windows 10 adoption and Android versions a few years ago at the Keynote, to rapturous applause. I for one am staying on Sequoia as the OS looks like a children's toy on Tahoe.

Re: The struggle of resizing windows on macOS Tahoe

#950

Post by 72deluxe »

gwbas1c wrote: post #749
bborud wrote: post #721

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand why Apple change things needlessly. What other purpose does it serve? How does this positively affect the bottom line? How does it improve life for Apple's users? Breaking basic interaction with windows purely because someone feels we should waste more screen real-estate on ornamentation by having bigger radius rounded corners is, for lack of a better word, stupid. I'd like Apple to focus more on t…

Because if you don't make periodic cosmetic changes, people will think you're going out of business. It's why your favorite shoe company, that you buy from every 2-3 years when you wear out your favorite shoes, always has new styles and discontinues other styles. Converse is a great example.

But when Apple released macOS Snow Leopard (widely held to be great), it announced 0 new features over Leopard, to much applause. It focused exclusively on fixing issues, and was better for it.

Journalists will report whatever they get fed anyway (notice how they all talk gleefully over the wobbly new iPhone with a jutting-out camera bump when only a few years ago they talked gleefully about how flat the iPhone was, and then gleefully wrote about how their screen estate was invaded by a notch etc), so if Apple focused on fixing issues instead of short-attention-span apps (when was the last time you used "Image Playground"?) the media could report how committed to reliability and quality Apple is, gleefully.

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