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Denmark to raise retirement age to 70

telegraph.co.uk

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Re: Denmark to raise retirement age to 70

#931

Post by wsatb »

mike_hearn wrote: post #869
wsatb wrote: post #648

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You said there’s nothing sad about it and then followed it up with some pretty sad realities. It’s incredibly sad. People should be working less as we advance as a society, not more.

They are doing. When the pension system was created retirement age was roughly equal to life expectancy. Life expectancy went up but retirement age never did, creating these super-long retirements for healthy people who could easily still work. That is where a lot of the wealth newly created by technological progress went.

This is a nice outlook from a vacuum. The reality is those perfectly healthy elderly people are still going to struggle to compete with the younger workforce who will be anything from more physically/mentally apt to just simply cheaper. So they’re probably going to be forced into retirement without the means to actually do it.

Not to mention, from strictly a human view, working someone to their death is just plain wrong. This isn’t about enjoying a retirement which is near impossible at that age or shortly after, it’s about not screwing over people by putting them into poverty due to really no fault of their own.

I hope the youth are kinder to you when you reach old age.

Re: Denmark to raise retirement age to 70

#933

Post by anticensor »

bialpio wrote: post #619
ggregoire wrote: post #591

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From what I understand if you retire early you must fund your retirement until the end. So you either work until the requested age and get something, or you don't and don't get anything. You can't just stop at 60, fund your retirement from 60 to 70, and then expect the gov to pay for your retirement from 70 to the end. Maybe I'm wrong tho.

Not sure how it works in Denmark but in Poland you have to work certain amount of years (20-25) to qualify for retirement even though the retirement age is 60-65. The amount you get depends on how much you paid into the system, so you will get less for not working, but it'll not prevent you from receiving the pension. And in the US, you become eligible for pension after just 10 years of paying into the system.

Whereas in Turkey you will actually get less if you continue working after you become eligible (65 years of age and 25 years of work, with some exceptions, early exit with partial pay available after 40 years of age) to retire (unless you get enough income to have your premiums paid at maximum, in which case you get a very slow increase in pension for the time after you become eligible).

Re: Denmark to raise retirement age to 70

#934

Post by LunaSea »

4gotunameagain wrote: post #769
gandalfian wrote: post #272

Denmark, 6 million wealthy people, 4% economic growth, 1.5% inflation, 2.9% unemployment, national debt of 25% of GDP and budget in surplus. How did it all go so right?

Having lived in Denmark for quite a while, I will say that it is the societal coherence, and an attitude of working together for all which must have been influenced with the difficulty of surviving in that landscape in the past. Societal coherence has been aided by the isolation, and here is the hot take: this cannot exist in "diverse" societies. Not because of bullshit genetic superiority justifications, but because…

> and an attitude of working together for all

I don't know much about Denmark but somehow I doubt that this attitude extends to taxing rich pensioners more (since they didn't contribute enough).

Re: Denmark to raise retirement age to 70

#935

Post by LunaSea »

simianwords wrote: post #105
WinstonSmith84 wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

maybe you don't like it to be called a Ponzi scheme, but the reality is that it is one. Definition of a Ponzi scheme: A Ponzi scheme is an investment fraud that pays existing investors with funds collected from new investor. Ponzi scheme organizers often promise to invest your money and generate high returns with little or no risk. But in many Ponzi schemes, the fraudsters do not invest the money. Instead, they use i…

i disagree. this is not at all a ponzi scheme. as you have pointed out the ponzi scheme has no value outside of the system and relies on deception to convince people to buy in to it. crucially the investment scheme provides no "value". pensions on the other hand don't have the quality of deception and the value is straightforward - it redistributes wealth from the younger population to the older ones. this reduces th…

> pensions on the other hand don't have the quality of deception

Writing this in an article about how a country rug-pulled it's young citizens is quite amusing.

If that's not deception, I don't know what is.

> you don't need a pyramid here, just somewhat equal proportions of population on each side

Which hasn't been the case in how many years already?

Re: Denmark to raise retirement age to 70

#936

Post by LunaSea »

dainiusse wrote: post #162
nialv7 wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

well in this context it generally means the age someone starts to receive state pension.

Yes. But the wider meaning is - you are in control

But you're not because the country decides how much they take out of your wage for pension and at what age you can access it.

Re: Denmark to raise retirement age to 70

#937

Post by 4gotunameagain »

LunaSea wrote: post #934
4gotunameagain wrote: post #769

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having lived in Denmark for quite a while, I will say that it is the societal coherence, and an attitude of working together for all which must have been influenced with the difficulty of surviving in that landscape in the past. Societal coherence has been aided by the isolation, and here is the hot take: this cannot exist in "diverse" societies. Not because of bullshit genetic superiority justifications, but because…

> and an attitude of working together for all I don't know much about Denmark but somehow I doubt that this attitude extends to taxing rich pensioners more (since they didn't contribute enough).

In a coherent, collaborative society, one is willing to endure some personal hardship for the collective benefit or out of necessity.

Re: Denmark to raise retirement age to 70

#938

Post by 4gotunameagain »

halfmatthalfcat wrote: post #838
4gotunameagain wrote: post #828

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Portraying the largest conquest and ethnic cleansing of the Americas as a deliberate experiment to figure out multiculturalism leaves a bitter taste, I'm not gonna lie. And if you gave me a choice between a world divided in small Denmarks or between the contemporary re-armament of the west due to the election of a populist buffoon combined with decades of mismanagement of a unipolar world, I wouldn't think twice.

Every culture has sins and skeletons. That’s not to absolve them but if we’re comparing contemporary national cultures, their stability and demographic makeup, it’s obviously a spectrum of stability, progress, etc.

Every empire has sins and skeletons.

Re: Denmark to raise retirement age to 70

#939

Post by LunaSea »

_elf wrote: post #16
Supermancho wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Won't be a long wait till it gets raised to 80. The demographics of many nations are pretty grim.

[flagged]

In most EU countries the middleastern immigration that was brought in in the last 10 years has a negative ROI.

Re: Denmark to raise retirement age to 70

#940

Post by xboxnolifes »

itsoktocry wrote: post #467
Robotbeat wrote: post #295

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Part of the reason employees are reticent to hire someone past 50 is before they worry they’ll retire soon, even if they’re mentally and physically in good shape. So increasing the retirement age might actually improve the ability of folks in their 50s to find work. Not saying this is a great trend, but it’s unavoidable due to the low fertility rate (already a problem everywhere in the developed world and soon to be…

Young people today job hop like there's no tomorrow.

Companies today get rid of employees like there is no tomorrow.
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