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Who makes the most reliable new cars?

consumerreports.org

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Re: Who makes the most reliable new cars?

#931

Post by everdrive »

CraigJPerry wrote: post #798
jimbob45 wrote: post #702

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cell phones were a huge mistake. I was walking my dog and saw someone eyes fully down doing 20 in the street. It was late and empty but if anyone had been in the street, they’d have been dead. That distraction didn’t exist 25 years ago on the scale it does today. I wish cell phone use penalties would be promoted closer to those of alcohol use while driving.

Mobile phone use is just a symptom. Everyone fiddling with their fancy in-car radio with distracting bright flashing display in the 90s was just a symptom. People fixing their hair in the mirror in the 70s while driving was just a symptom. It doesn’t matter what distractions you remove - ban eating and drinking (even water) while driving, impose ruinous fines for those caught… none of it will work. You need to addres…

The root cause is human nature, which has been warped by various environmental factors: cell phones, traffic density, lack of experience being the pedestrian, etc.

The human nature isn’t going away, and although the environmental factors are technically under our control, they’re just getting worse.

The fact that technology only made a pre-existing issue worse does not mean that technology is not the problem.

Re: Who makes the most reliable new cars?

#932

Post by t0bia_s »

culi wrote: post #866
t0bia_s wrote: post #767

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also with increasing size of vehicles, fuel consumption raise as well. We just pretend, that we care about environment untill we start speaking about our safety.

the only reason people feel like they need a bigger car is because of all the other big cars on the road. A vicious spiral

Because car producers make them. And we gladly buy them.

Re: Who makes the most reliable new cars?

#933

Post by everdrive »

hot_gril wrote: post #640
webel0 wrote: post #232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, I keep on thinking that a premium market will develop for Toyota and Honda cars from roughly ~2006-2010. Those cars were the height of internal combustion technology without all of the electronics.

This is the era of my 3 cars, but really they weren't the height of ICE tech. There was a breakthrough in power/efficiency around 2018. I just like how non-fussy the older cars are and how they look.

The the breakthroughs you’re referring to are direct injection, then those come with their own downsides. Either severely reduced reliability (when solely using Gasoline Direction Injection (GDI) injectors) or increased cost and complexity. (When using a dual-injection setup, such as GDI + Port Fuel Injection (PFI))

Re: Who makes the most reliable new cars?

#934

Post by jocaal »

underlipton wrote: post #367
denvaar wrote: post #343

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> extremely mechanical 4Runner Same sentiment for my washer/dryer. Bought an older (used) set for $300, They have lasted 7 years so far, which is in addition to however long they were in use before: I would guess at least 7 more. Seems like lots of people lament how things like cars, refrigerators, washers, etc. are becoming less mechanical and more electronic. Maybe there's a market for "bespoke" mechanical items.

Electronic stuff is still reparable. Probably even more cheaply, in some regards (certainly material cost). We've just been made to become accustomed to viewing electronic devices as disposable/primarily replaceable. And while most people have turned a wrench before, knowing how to use a soldering iron/heat gun/magnifier effectively is not a common skill. Could be, though.

Repairing electronics is not fun. Ask any undergraduate that spent hours looking for broken op-amps and bad solder joints. I don't think its the same class of repairability as old cars.

Re: Who makes the most reliable new cars?

#935

Post by 93po »

Lazare wrote: post #373
93po wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Data around cars is notoriously complete bullshit. One example is that one of the main metrics used by a very big name, maybe CR, is “reliability compared to * expectations* ”. Obviously cars that people have high expectations for (Teslas) are going to score horribly here even if they are objectively more reliable than other brands. And of course they bury this little fact way down in the info and everyone walks away…

The linked article is pretty explicit about how they calculate it. A detailed explanation is literally the first section. And as they explain, they ask people about the actual problems they've had in the last 12 months with their car; nothing soft or fuzzy or relative to expectations at all.

If I ask you about your experience with a Rolls Royce you'd probably mention in the door rattles a little bit between the speeds of 55 and 60mph. If I ask the same question about an entry level Toyota I doubt people would think anything of it or mention it. This is especially impacted if you're used to buying cars that cost $75k (a lot of Tesla owners) versus used to owning preowned cars bought for $10k

Re: Who makes the most reliable new cars?

#936

Post by everdrive »

to11mtm wrote: post #561
nebula8804 wrote: post #509

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To me it feels like Mazda did it right even though they got a lot of crap for it. Still feels like they are a hidden gem. What they did was focus on fleet average . Their thesis was whats the point of being green if you still are selling gas guzzling hogs and you just sell some garbage EV to offset them. So what they did was first drop their pickup truck and then develop a smooth and efficient 4 cylinder engine mated…

Mazda does OK. They did have their own missteps (a diesel) but they at least haven't been Toyota'd like Subaru. > Their thesis was whats the point of being green if you still are selling gas guzzling hogs and you just sell some garbage EV to offset them. Ford doesn't do this, but at the same time I find it hilariously suspicious that despite the success of the Maverick, there doesn't seem to be any messaging about in…

I don’t know what’s going on at Ford, but it seems to be nothing but production issues with them. They have constraints on nearly all of their popular vehicles, and are losing tons of sales. I wanted a Maverick, but had to settle for a Nissan Frontier since Ford can’t seem to build one.

Re: Who makes the most reliable new cars?

#937

Post by giobox »

Syonyk wrote: post #468
giobox wrote: post #350

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "First and foremost, the transmission replaces the rather staggering pile of complexity of a modern automatic transmission, typically, with "a few motor/generators, some planetary gears, maybe a band that only engages when a motor is already stopped, and some power electronics." Compared to the 9+ speed automatics, this is dramatically simpler. Quite a few hybrids don't even have a mechanical reverse gear, it's jus…

Are you using PHEV as "Plugin Hybrid Electric Vehicle" in the sense of "Has a long range on battery only"? The ones I'm familiar with (which, admittedly, don't cover the ones you use) are all "parallel drivetrain" sorts of things, with a Prius-type transmission. Though I'm really only familiar with the Prius and Volt type drivetrains.

No - I'm using it in the exact same sense Consumer Reports did here and the car industry at large does - Hybrid cars that have a CCS charging port or similar and can run on electric only propulsion for some period of time. There are far more PHEV models on sale than just the Volt and Prius. If I recall correctly, the Volt isn't even sold anymore.

This is the same definition wikipedia uses too:

"A plug-in hybrid electric vehicle (PHEV) is a hybrid electric vehicle whose battery pack can be recharged by plugging a charging cable into an external electric power source, in addition to internally by its on-board internal combustion engine-powered generator."

> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plug-in_hybrid

Re: Who makes the most reliable new cars?

#938

Post by [deleted] »

mulmen wrote: post #228
bluemax wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My Toyota hybrid reliably does not start after 4 weeks not driving. The 12 volt (1 year old) battery is drained too much after such a period of inactivity. I was not expecting this from Toyota, pretty disappointing.

This is true of basically every car ever. Lead acid batteries can’t maintain a charge forever. Get a battery tender if you aren’t going to drive for long periods of time. If you only drive once a month do you even need to own a car? Just rent/uber when you occasionally need a car.

[deleted]

Re: Who makes the most reliable new cars?

#939

Post by StillBored »

saulrh wrote: post #285
AmVess wrote: post #230

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Keep the 4Runner and buy something new for a family hauler. New vehicles are much safer from a structural standpoint than older ones. Modern high strength steels form the safety cage of the vehicle, and greatly reduce the risk of injury in offset frontal impacts, side impacts, and rear impacts. And then you have the multitudes of air bags. Finally, the various electronic gizmos that further reduce risk of injury. The…

To expand... - Improved FEM makes modern crumple zones deeper and smoother - Heavy use of composites dramatically improve the raw amount of energy absorbed by the car instead of the passengers - Better manufacturing methods mean parts can be shaped/placed to be less likely to enter the cabin - Better placement of more airbags means you're more likely to hit something soft - Better seats and better placements of bette…

Traction and stability control, are one of those things I wonder if they aren't negated by human factors.

I have an old 90's tachoma that doesn't even have antilock brakes. It drives a bit like a car when compared with a modern truck, but the rear will slide out even on gentle curves, in the rain it can slide hundreds of feet when stopping (yah pulse the breaks manually), and its narrow and high meaning they roll over if you look at it wrong. One doesn't feel "safe" in it, and you know to maintain a lot of stopping distance, slow down before curves, and generally drive like a 90 year old. I have a much newer tundra. It is a brick on wheels with magic traction control, and it feels glued to the road because of it. Except it is easy to fail to respect it and discover one is simply going too fast into a turn, or a stoplight/whatever, and the antilock and traction control aren't going to save you. The one significant advantage is that you can steer it into a ditch while panicking rather than ramming it straight into oncoming traffic when that happens.

So, i'm betting in the end, the more aggressive driving the turndra encourages by giving people more of a feeling of being in control negates some of the additional safety. It's like power steering lets tiny women (and men) drive massive trucks/SUVs they wouldn't otherwise drive if they had to crank those huge tires holding all that weight manually.

Re: Who makes the most reliable new cars?

#940

Post by [deleted] »

ajross wrote: post #144
kspacewalk2 wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd hold off on declaring that the EV boat has departed. It remains to be seen at what level EV uptake will plateau, without major advances in battery tech and EV practicality. Coming from a rather nippy Canadian city which bought a bunch of electric buses, fucked up badly[0] and probably made purchasing more electric buses an untenable proposition for (conservatively) 5-7 years, and having heard from multiple EV own…

Not interested in EV flamery. My point was economic: clearly EVs are a very large new market segment, and Japanese brands aren't competing there at all. That's bad, if your business is to sell cars. It's really bad if you have a sub-brand, like "Hybrids", which has been completely decimated by the (again very real, even if you don't think anyone in Edmonton should buy them) move to electric devices in the market. Bas…

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