Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

missionlocal.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

931–940 of 1001 posts

Re: Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

#931

Post by ipqk »

Pils wrote: post #740
j4pe wrote: post #20

Joe Eskenazi, the author of this piece, is a solid journalist who helps run the tiny donation-funded Mission Local. They've done incredible reporting on corruption in the SF city government and punch way above their weight in the stories they break. I have respect for how Joe refused to join in reporting this murder as evidence of a violent crime epidemic, while still reporting on homelessness and property crime.

The current CEO of YCombinator regarding an article in Mission Local a few days ago: Mission Local seems to serve their local bureaucratic masters over the basic public safety needs of the people. [0] This is gaslighting. You should be ashamed. [1] In this case they are “independent” of a sort [2] In all fairness, he did retweet this article a couple hours ago. [0] https://twitter.com/garrytan/status/1644520924828540…

I think he un-retweeted it, and then re-tweeted someone else still blaming it on "lawlessness".

Re: Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

#932

Post by A4ET8a8uTh0 »

gowld wrote: post #921
jjcon wrote: post #910

> San Francisco authorities hit back at Elon Musk and others who had used Lee’s killing to criticize law enforcement in the city. Tagline is kinda weird... isn't murder kinda indicative of a law enforcement failure?

No. Law enforcement's job is to arrest and punish murderers, not prevent murders.

Yes and no. Law enforcement's job is in its name. It is to enforce. It is to be the visible arm of otherwise ephemeral law that we agreed upon as society through, hopefully, some sort of consensus. And yes, their presence also serves that purpose, but they are not there to punish ( although I am sure we are all tempted to tip scales at times ). That job is typically the domain of another public institution.

Re: Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

#933

Post by jeffbee »

jjcon wrote: post #924
gowld wrote: post #921

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No. Law enforcement's job is to arrest and punish murderers, not prevent murders.

You can't possibly be serious, right? So what is the point of police patrol? Adjusting police presence in different areas? Community initiatives? Prevention is definitively a key component of modern policing at least in every city and country I have lived in. If that isn't the case in SF I'd say then that they have obviously failed on all levels at enforcing the law. Not to mention, punishment is definitely not the j…

What level of police ubiquity are you proposing, such that it would have prevented two people from two other cities from driving to SF in the middle of the night and starting a fatal altercation inside a car?

Re: Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

#934

Post by bandyaboot »

jjcon wrote: post #910

> San Francisco authorities hit back at Elon Musk and others who had used Lee’s killing to criticize law enforcement in the city. Tagline is kinda weird... isn't murder kinda indicative of a law enforcement failure?

I suppose this was a case of a failure of law enforcement insomuch as the SFPD has failed to find/hire a trio of precogs.

Re: Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

#935

Post by projectazorian »

JimDabell wrote: post #630
timmytokyo wrote: post #488

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Every major city has a crime problem and always has. The question is whether the situation is being blown out of proportion by sensationalist media or people with axes to grind. For a group that claims to be so rational, much of the HN crowd commenting here does seem to be averse to relying upon actual data.

> Every major city has a crime problem and always has. This isn’t true. The idea that cities must inherently have crime problems is a form of learned helplessness. You think they must have crime problems because it’s all you’ve ever experienced. Try visiting a city that has low crime, like Singapore or Tokyo.

I don't think many of us would sign up for bringing the Singaporean or Japanese criminal justice systems to the US. Both places have very little due process and Singapore's police have near-unlimited surveillance powers with very little judicial oversight, not sure about Japan.

Re: Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

#936

Post by clipsy »

jjcon wrote: post #924
gowld wrote: post #921

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No. Law enforcement's job is to arrest and punish murderers, not prevent murders.

You can't possibly be serious, right? So what is the point of police patrol? Adjusting police presence in different areas? Community initiatives? Prevention is definitively a key component of modern policing at least in every city and country I have lived in. If that isn't the case in SF I'd say then that they have obviously failed on all levels at enforcing the law. Not to mention, punishment is definitely not the j…

Police departments have fought legal battles specifically to avoid having any duty to protect civilians or to prevent a crime in progress if they so choose.[0] I do agree with you that they (not just in SF, but across America broadly) have in fact obviously failed on all levels, though.

[0]: https://www.findlaw.com/legalblogs/law-and-life/do-the-polic...

Re: Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

#937

Post by dpedu »

anigbrowl wrote: post #833
dpedu wrote: post #712

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a bad take and itself an emotional narrative. For one, the person arrested is a suspect and not in any way proven or admitted to be the killer. Putting that aside, it's still a bad take because you're ignoring the many other incidents that took place on the same day, such as the SF Fire Commissioner who was beaten with a metal pipe by random drug users outside his house.

the SF Fire Commissioner who was beaten with a metal pipe by random drug users outside his house Former fire commissioner, not outside his house (actually a parent's home), and what makes you so sure it was random? A man was arrested for that, who alleges that the victim initiated the confrontation by pepper spraying him. I'm quite interested in that case as I have relevant personal knowledge about people involved, b…

I said random because I haven't heard of anything linking the attacker and the commissioner beyond that the attacker was homeless and camped near the house.

> who alleges that the victim initiated the confrontation by pepper spraying him.

The reports I have seen state that the attacker claims the victim sprayed him with bear mace, not pepper spray. Regardless of this - and other minute points that don't matter - the subsequent footage of the attack shows the commissioner turning his back to and running away from the attacker, who quickly gives chase. It doesn't matter who started it; there's no justification for continuing the assault in such a situation.

Re: Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

#938

Post by dmix »

threatofrain wrote: post #867
dmix wrote: post #426

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Everyone is a victim of this stuff, not just the upper class. Poor people getting to work having their car windows smashed multiple times is a serious issue. But the constant drumbeat of property crime, dirtiness, and leud acts in public it gets downplayed because the murder rate is less than it was during some prior horrible time in the city's history and people feel some need to defend their own city (and the parti…

SF’s homicide rate is below the national average.

Yep, people haven't been complaining about murders. It's almost entire the property crime and general lawlessness. This murder just gave people the opportunity to whine about the plight.

Re: Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

#939

Post by 1vuio0pswjnm7 »

mztwo wrote: post #22

As the news media and twitterverse peddled the whole "crime-ridden SF" angle, I felt myself getting drawn into the same topic and agreeing with numerous friends on how much the city has declined. This is a good reminder of how we gravitate towards powerful emotional narratives, which in the moment can feel absolutely true despite an utter lack of supporting facts on an individual murder case. I hope this brings some…

Maybe it's time to stop paying attention to what Elon Musk and other so-called "tech industry" people publish on the internet. These are not journalists and it is not "news". It's garbage.

Maybe it's time to wake up.

One can only imagine what these two "tech industry" people were arguing about before one killed the other. The media reports make them sound like such wonderfully nice people, drinking and driving around SF at 2am on a Tuesday, one of them liking stay out to the wee hours on weeknights the other liking to keep butterfly and switch blades in his car. One of them apparently believed an "emotional narrative" about SF being in decline; that's allegedly why he moved to Miami.

Here is the Expand IT Inc. website, listing the survivor's colleagues.

https://web.archive.org/web/20230413142515if_/https://www.ex...

All these references to "Cash App" in the articles about this crime yet none explaining its main use has been amongst criminals.

Re: Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

#940

Post by igetspam »

Alupis wrote: post #919
woodruffw wrote: post #917

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The suspect is indeed innocent until proven guilty. I haven't advanced any claim that this particular suspect is the perpetrator; only that violent crimes are overwhelmingly committed by people known to their victims. I hope that we can extend the same fundamental legal skepticism to society's most needy.

> violent crimes are overwhelmingly committed by people known to their victims. Homicide. Homicide is overwhelmingly committed by people known to their victims. Violent Crime includes armed robbery, aggravated assault, forcible rape and murder. Not all of these crimes share that statistic.

Most of them do though. You are much more likely to be murdered or raped (no need for the qualifier, by definition it's all forced) by a man you know.
Post reply on HN