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Joint statement by the Department of the Treasury, Federal Reserve, and FDIC

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Re: Joint statement by the Department of the Treasury, Federal Reserve, and FDIC

#931

We deserve to see more useful top comments on this matter. The top ones in this and the main announcement thread [1] are just ad hominem complaining against some ostensibly "salty" or "cognitively dissonant" majority. Let's talk about skin in the game and bailouts. Explain to a peasant why he should have to share the risk you took with your money. Explain to him this game being played where he gains nothing when you…

You are better off because the government is helping, and so are all of the people in the country who need to work for a living and need companies to work for. You can't let the banking system collapse and expect it will only hurt the people you don't like. > If these statements are true, can someone explain how it's possible that despositors are fully protected, far beyond what FDIC insures, without the taxpayer bea…

> "The FDIC is not supported by public funds; member banks' insurance dues are its primary source of funding. When dues and the proceeds of bank liquidations are insufficient, it can borrow from the federal government, or issue debt through the Federal Financing Bank on terms that the bank decides."

If you're trying to say "look, 'taxpayer' isn't mentioned, all good", you're either in self-delusion or you're playing dumb. It doesn't matter how you dress it - "taxpayer money", QE, Sammy's piggybank - the inflationary repercussions will affect everyone.

> On top of that, SVB has the money to pay back almost all of the depositors. They just don't have it liquid right now because it's in bonds that won't mature for a while and would need to be sold for a loss.

This is a self-contradiction, yet it's written as an explanation. Bravo.

> You can vote for people who are dumb enough to let the entire banking system collapse because they want to hurt rich people. But of course that would probably put "peasants" out of work while the rich get slightly less rich.

This isn't about "hurting rich people", you can throw away that straw man (along with the twitter favorite "it's not a bailout, the bank equity goes to zero!"). It's about the response to a complex system's failure. Most would agree injecting liquidity ASAP is mandatory in the short-term, but that does not mandate insuring 100% of deposits. Any sort of response has negative repercussions, but it isn't a matter of fact that the banking system would collapse otherwise.

Nobody has "the answers", it's a complex system. The VC tech bro take draws a line in the sand and cries wolf for any approach that doesn't cover them 100%, and it's done under the guise of looking out for others; "the workers", "the banking system", "the economy", "a generation of technological progress evaporated".

Is it possible that the best thing to do for the long-term is to allow a worse short-term outcome (affecting a small part of the economy more drastically), so that the system is altered in a way that actually fixes/improves it? Even if we grant that hypothetical, should it be done? It's a complex question with no right answer.

The VC tech bro take on technological advancements that have negative short-term side effects, wiping industries and causing people to lose jobs usually falls in the range of "learn to code" to "that sucks, but we must march forward". There is a poignant sense of hypocrisy when grandstanding holier-than-thou "technologists" who claim in abstract that progress and efficiency trump all, find themselves on the other side and act oh so predictably.

The cynical responders aren't partaking in the question of "what is the correct response", but just because they don't gobble up the predictable VC tech bro take as gospel doesn't make them dumb.

Re: Joint statement by the Department of the Treasury, Federal Reserve, and FDIC

#932

Yellen and the FDIC is in a tough spot. This is the important line, "Any losses to the Deposit Insurance Fund to support uninsured depositors will be recovered by a special assessment on banks, as required by law." Thus, on one hand, I'm glad they're doing this, as it should help prevent wider bank runs, and it ensures that banks are the ones that are actually paying for it. At the same time, this is yet another exam…

> Yellen has just broadcast that FDIC insurance is essentially unlimited, as long as you can threaten wider disruption to the economy. I think everyone knew that already. Since 2008 at least. It's very possible that if this is not done, the only banks left at the end of the week will be the "too big to fail" ones. A domino effect is very hard to prevent when it's based entirely on consumer confidence and those consum…

Let's try spreading cynicism and enjoy the fireworks when the hollow reassurances don't work.

Re: Joint statement by the Department of the Treasury, Federal Reserve, and FDIC

#933

Yellen and the FDIC is in a tough spot. This is the important line, "Any losses to the Deposit Insurance Fund to support uninsured depositors will be recovered by a special assessment on banks, as required by law." Thus, on one hand, I'm glad they're doing this, as it should help prevent wider bank runs, and it ensures that banks are the ones that are actually paying for it. At the same time, this is yet another exam…

>At the same time, this is yet another example of changing the rules in the middle of the game. Yellen has just broadcast that FDIC insurance is essentially unlimited, as long as you can threaten wider disruption to the economy. No, there are systemic risk exceptions within the rules. If a bank is large enough, then the systemic risk to the economy as a whole is large enough to warrant this step. "Too big to fail" is…

While what you say is true, maybe we shouldn't allow mergers and other avenues to allow these banks (and other verticals) to be too big to fail. We've made that a target for all companies. Just get too big to fail and you get all the upside and none of the downside for free. That is my main complaint. By allowing deposits to be invested without risk, these too big to fail banks are encouraged to chase the highest yield, highest risk re-investments possible. If it works, another yacht for everyone! If it fails, we must be made whole!

Re: Joint statement by the Department of the Treasury, Federal Reserve, and FDIC

#934
Nothing is going to change in this country until people start questioning how we have seemingly limitless money for foreign aid, wars, bank bailouts, etc. but we can’t seem to get shit done for working class people. It’s not a left vs right issue. It’s a class and power issue.

Re: Joint statement by the Department of the Treasury, Federal Reserve, and FDIC

#936

Yellen and the FDIC is in a tough spot. This is the important line, "Any losses to the Deposit Insurance Fund to support uninsured depositors will be recovered by a special assessment on banks, as required by law." Thus, on one hand, I'm glad they're doing this, as it should help prevent wider bank runs, and it ensures that banks are the ones that are actually paying for it. At the same time, this is yet another exam…

If it didn't happen so fast they probably would have gotten some kind of bailout before fdic stepped in.

Re: Joint statement by the Department of the Treasury, Federal Reserve, and FDIC

#937

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> At the same time, this is yet another example of changing the rules in the middle of the game. Yellen has just broadcast that FDIC insurance is essentially unlimited, as long as you can threaten wider disruption to the economy. The criteria isn't threatening a "wider disruption to the economy", it's threatening the quality of life of a certain class of people. When unions threaten a wider disruption to the economy…

> The criteria isn't threatening a "wider disruption to the economy", it's threatening the quality of life of a certain class of people. In support of this view, they could have easily extended FDIC on a dynamic metric, for example 20k for each employee. If you are 5 employee VC fund sitting on 0.5 billion in cash, no bailout for you from taxpayer money (because let's be real, FDIC is all taxpayer money, it's irrelev…

> In support of this view, they could have easily extended FDIC on a dynamic metric, for example 20k for each employee.

Implementing any such "dynamic metric" would have taken time, which would mean they would not have been able to restore all deposits by Monday, which means a significant risk of contagion.

Re: Joint statement by the Department of the Treasury, Federal Reserve, and FDIC

#938
post #530

With this news, I'm opening a bank. Here is my business plan: 1. Make risky investments and offer better terms than other banks 2. Watch business flock to me 3. Get filthy rich on yearly bonuses 4. 10 years later my risky investments blow up (Make sure to sell stock before) 5. Get taken over by the FDIC 6. Don't return those years of bonuses 7. Let other banks pay for my wrongdoing with a "special assessment" 8. Walk…

Is this any different without steps 5 and 7? I don't understand how the FDIC actions change the incentives here.

The FDIC's actions indicate that the insured deposit limit is really unlimited instead of the advertised $250,000.

This takes away a huge risk associated with recklessly handling depositors money because now the FDIC will swoop in and make ALL depositors whole.

Re: Joint statement by the Department of the Treasury, Federal Reserve, and FDIC

#939

We deserve to see more useful top comments on this matter. The top ones in this and the main announcement thread [1] are just ad hominem complaining against some ostensibly "salty" or "cognitively dissonant" majority. Let's talk about skin in the game and bailouts. Explain to a peasant why he should have to share the risk you took with your money. Explain to him this game being played where he gains nothing when you…

> Explain to a peasant why he should have to share the risk you took with your money.

Dear Peasant,

I empathize with your pain and suffering on a daily basis. I know life isn’t easy being a peasant, you perhaps work as hard as anyone in Silicon Valley. You pay taxes just like everyone else and expect your government to protect you and provide opportunities not just for you but for your children and their’s. Silicon Valley is a major growth engine of our economy, it means lots of jobs for your future grand grandchildren. It means better lives for all of us benefiting from innovations that happen there. You no longer need to farm in freezing weather when your John Deere tractor can drive itself or hail a ride on Uber and know exactly when to go outside on a snowy day. So hope you understand that when a place that people trust with keeping their money collapses it means major disruption to the economy. It means those tech companies have to fold not to a fault of their own, but because of a series of domino effects that would have been not easy to predict. It comes with the territory, not too dissimilar to a famine. We need to do something to save those companies and thousands of people who work there contributing to the prosperity of our country and the world. We need to do what is smart, socially and economically responsible and save those companies by providing the cash reserves they stored in the failed bank. We need to borrow money from the tax payers to do that, just like when we did that in the last couple of years to help another group of citizens. I know you understand this is good not just for our country but it’s good for you and your children. I know many will not understand why a large population of the medium class should benefit as if they live in a vacuum and anything that happens to them will have no effect on the rest of us.

I know you will.

Re: Joint statement by the Department of the Treasury, Federal Reserve, and FDIC

#940

I have never seen such cognitive dissonance here at HN -- which I feel is really saying something! As an SVB customer who had to wire payroll on Tuesday, our perspective is naturally sharpened, but I found the lack of empathy here over the weekend galling. On the one hand, this is understandable, and Silicon Valley has done much to earn collective distrust. On the other hand, this is emphatically not all of us: many…

This is such a childish response. You're essentially saying to the community: "stop saying things I don't like!"
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