Apple has threatened to ban Parler from the App Store • Hacker News Board

Re: Apple has threatened to ban Parler from the App Store

#931

Post by walleeee » Sat, Jan 09, 2021, 1:52 PM UTC

bun_at_work wrote: post #765

handedness wrote: post #672

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You have a rosier view of five years ago than I do. Anyway, demagogues are products of their respective times. To focus on them and their personalities and their rhetoric is to completely miss the forest. Edit: In fact, that approach is part of what gives them their power. And it certainly makes avoiding their ascent nearly impossible.

Miss what forest, specifically? I agree with you about demagogues being products of their times. In this case it seems the forest being missed is social media platforms allowing intolerant content and the organization of domestic terrorism. If that is your point, then I agree. Social media companies need to do more to fight against the pressures that allow demagogues rise to power. Deplatforming them seems like a goo…

One forest few seem to want to take seriously is: why do we pay so much attention to social media that all this is happening in the first place?

Re: Apple has threatened to ban Parler from the App Store

#932

Post by asiachick » Sat, Jan 09, 2021, 2:00 PM UTC

I don't know if it will be this particular event but ... my imagined scenario goes like this

Apple and Google ban Parler. Parler people spread the word how to sideload on Android. Parler people on iOS get angry and lobby their congress people to force Apple to allow sideloading and/or alternate stores.

I don't think you can really prevent people from communicating. Yes it sucks they're lying to each other and causing a ruckus. Can you imagine if they managed to do this via the phone and the phone companies cancelled their phone service. Yes, I know the phone company can't do that legally but that's precisely my point. These people are going to push for laws that allow them to communicate however they want.

Removing the apps from Google Play and Apple App store will not stop this.

Or at least that's my prediction. I have no solution unfortunately. This seems like the new norm. In fact maybe it's part of the great filter: Mass many to many communication and its repercussions.

Re: Apple has threatened to ban Parler from the App Store

#933

Post by throw0101a » Sat, Jan 09, 2021, 2:03 PM UTC

handedness wrote: post #703

throw0101a wrote: post #676

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How did each of those work out for the slaves?

Well, for some of them, pretty darned well. A lot better than for their slaveowners, at least. Anyway, I'm not sure what your point is. Mine was that a lot happened before the 1960s, and much of it wasn't pretty.

Actually my statement (first sentence) was about the century before the 1960s, i.e., after the US Civil War when the slaves were already 'free'.

Re: Apple has threatened to ban Parler from the App Store

#934

Post by TheAdamAndChe » Sat, Jan 09, 2021, 2:04 PM UTC

jariel wrote: post #919

TheAdamAndChe wrote: post #908

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Voter ID, removal of hackable voting machines, and hand count of votes are not disenfranchisement. You may have been told by the media that it is, but it's not. Many advanced democracies have such things in place.

This is completely false. The machines are not hacked, and the voter rolls are legitimate. There is zero evidence of systematic fraud, therefore, there is no 'disenfranchisement'. To suggest that 'maybe one day, someone could mess with our election' is not 'disenfranchisement'. "You may have been told by the media" - Rudy Giuilani and the President clearly failed to make a case or provide any evidence - moreover, the…

> The machines are not hacked, and the voter rolls are legitimate.

> The election was fine - Trump's claims of fraud are completely fabricated.

Their capacity to claim fraud is _because_ of these weaknesses that make such a claim possible. Regardless of what the truth is, there are millions of people who think the election was rigged. If we don't placate those people and fix the issues, it could continue to escalate.

Re: Apple has threatened to ban Parler from the App Store

#935

Post by FridgeSeal » Sat, Jan 09, 2021, 2:06 PM UTC

totony wrote: post #868

FridgeSeal wrote: post #736

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They found their own pool to go pee in, and now they’re surprised that nobody wants to swim with them. It’s not everyone else’s fault that nobody else wants to be around these people. If you go to the pub and start picking fights you’ll be avoided and thrown out pretty quickly. This is the same: they went off and created their own app, their behaviour got worse, and now nobody else wants to deal with them. What is un…

Comparing Google and Apple to the local pub is disingenuous. Google alone could buy all the pubs in the UK with its one-year revenue (or one-year profit, if my calculations are correct)

That is beside the point though - it's an analogy to illustrate what I mean: we can come up with an example that doesn't have anything to do with money if you'd prefer. The main point is that we're not obliged to have them as customers, and if _everyone_ is getting to the point where they're saying "we don't want you as a customer" maybe the problem is the customer, not the "censorship".

Re: Apple has threatened to ban Parler from the App Store

#936

Post by FridgeSeal » Sat, Jan 09, 2021, 2:11 PM UTC

zaroth wrote: post #752

FridgeSeal wrote: post #736

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They found their own pool to go pee in, and now they’re surprised that nobody wants to swim with them. It’s not everyone else’s fault that nobody else wants to be around these people. If you go to the pub and start picking fights you’ll be avoided and thrown out pretty quickly. This is the same: they went off and created their own app, their behaviour got worse, and now nobody else wants to deal with them. What is un…

Your analogy makes no sense? The users within Parlor are very happy to be swimming in whatever it is they are swimming in over there. It’s the water department who wants to turn off the hose. Or some strained analogy like that.

More like they've setup their pool in a hotel room, but the neighbours are complaining about the noise and the hotel-owner doesn't want to have to clean pool-contents out of the carpet flooring when it inevitably spills, so they get asked to leave.

They leave, but make a new pool by filling up the back of the ute, this spills everywhere when they drive, ruins the suspension and is a safety hazard, nobody else is surprised when they get pulled over by the cops.

We've definitely strained the limits of the analogy here hahaha, but the point is that we're not obliged to have them as customers, and as another comments put it, they're not entitled to success.

Re: Apple has threatened to ban Parler from the App Store

#937

Post by jki275 » Sat, Jan 09, 2021, 2:16 PM UTC

athms wrote: post #798

jgwil2 wrote: post #679

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And yet if we look at it objectively, the right is clearly overrepresnted in our political system. Republicans lost the popular vote in five of the last six presidential elections. In the next presidential election there will be many eligible voters who weren't even born last time they won. The Senate gives a seven point advantage to Republicans. So please, explain to me where you get this idea that the right is "tre…

Also, SCOTUS has had a conservative majority (except during a vacancy) since 1989.

The first time SCOTUS has had a conservative majority since the 50s was when Amy Barrett was confirmed last year.

Maybe your definition of conservative is not the same as most conservatives, but that’s just how it is.

Re: Apple has threatened to ban Parler from the App Store

#938

Post by ivnubinas » Sat, Jan 09, 2021, 2:23 PM UTC

jariel wrote: post #919

TheAdamAndChe wrote: post #908

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Voter ID, removal of hackable voting machines, and hand count of votes are not disenfranchisement. You may have been told by the media that it is, but it's not. Many advanced democracies have such things in place.

This is completely false. The machines are not hacked, and the voter rolls are legitimate. There is zero evidence of systematic fraud, therefore, there is no 'disenfranchisement'. To suggest that 'maybe one day, someone could mess with our election' is not 'disenfranchisement'. "You may have been told by the media" - Rudy Giuilani and the President clearly failed to make a case or provide any evidence - moreover, the…

There is a lot of evidence of voter fraud. I'm not sure if enough to turn around a presidential election but it can change local ones. https://youtu.be/ZD1-dBrP4Pw

Re: Apple has threatened to ban Parler from the App Store

#939

Post by cannabis_sam » Sat, Jan 09, 2021, 2:39 PM UTC

nicbou wrote: post #11

Someone brought an interesting perspective in another thread and I can't shake it off. The other side keeps deplatforming them. Their legal cases are rejected. The mainstream media refuses to take them seriously. We're not even listening to them, because it's science and they're *ists if they disagree. We're not debating anymore. We just assume we're right. We are slowly squeezing a significant segment of the populat…

I think you might be making the mistake of thinking that all these people are actually arguing in good faith...

They don’t have explainable concerns, they just want the result of the presidential election changed for no other reason than that they prefer Trump over Biden.

Otherwise they would have accepted the outcome of all the legal challenges in court, where all the evidence they are relying on have been rejected.

But they don’t... these people keep reiterating evidence that has already been dismissed by multiple courts.

I absolutely agree that it’s deeply problematic to ignore the views of portions of the population.

But how do you reconcile Trump’s and his supporters vivid fantasy world with reality?

Re: Apple has threatened to ban Parler from the App Store

#940

Post by foolinaround » Sat, Jan 09, 2021, 2:55 PM UTC

sjg007 wrote: post #531

aksss wrote: post #521

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We've spent a couple years now (right?) tacitly approving rioting as an acceptable response to feeling disenfranchised. Now we're surprised when the same medicine gets used by others. For either side, I'm not sure it's proper minimize their complaints. If the BLM crowd says they have a serious problem with police violence, the best reaction is, "what can we do to restore confidence?" Similarly, when 40% of the countr…

The best thing is for republicans to admit that they are lying about election fraud.

how about following Ted Cruz's request, even if it is an academic excercise at this point, that will assuage the hot tempers on both sides?