Live data from Hacker News

New Windows 10 Devices From Microsoft

blogs.windows.com

931–940 of 989 posts

Re: New Windows 10 Devices From Microsoft

#931
post #822

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> While I hate the almost singular choice for OsX I actually find that this is less true now, and I miss when it was more true. There are a lot of choices now, not just at price points, but at form factors. Do I get a 13" MacBook Air, a 13" MacBook Pro Retina, a 12" MacBook, or the upcoming 12.9" iPad Pro?

I was just speaking to one of my devs about this today. Steve Jobs' turned Apple around by removing choice. You had a Consumer and Pro category and they each had a laptop and a desktop. The new Apple is slowly drifting into Dell territory, where I have too many options. It becomes the Netflix problem where I find myself having too many options, so I browse the offerings, and before I decide, fall asleep.

I think the problem is they're in a transitional phase right now. Retina displays aren't ubiquitous yet and are introducing an extra axis of differentiation on the one hand, while the new ultralight Macbook is the first example of a step change in form factors. They're a long way from PC manufacturers where the main distinction between two models can be as trivial as the audio chip and speaker specs.

Re: New Windows 10 Devices From Microsoft

#932

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Remember these? http://www.recycledgoods.com/media/extendware/ewimageopt/med... Never quite sure why the small connector didn't become the standard for laptops.

The 15-pin I/O connector for ethernet was part of the PCMCIA CardBus standard, which is why dongles could be shared between cards. After PCMCIA picked up speed, a "non-practicing entity" pulled a patent out of their portfolio for a "programmable connector". Because the PCMCIA ethernet card itself plugged into the computer and presented a different connector to the outside world, the NPE was able to sue and/or settle…

Well, that's actually an alternative. Instead of having a full standard RJ45 port, having a smaller laptop-friendly proprietary socket with a cheap plastic adapter to RJ45. The adapter would just be a piece of plastic and therefore this would avoid all the driver related problems and would not require manufacturers to pick up the phone to agree on a standard with their peers. That would work for me.

Re: New Windows 10 Devices From Microsoft

#933
post #822

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> While I hate the almost singular choice for OsX I actually find that this is less true now, and I miss when it was more true. There are a lot of choices now, not just at price points, but at form factors. Do I get a 13" MacBook Air, a 13" MacBook Pro Retina, a 12" MacBook, or the upcoming 12.9" iPad Pro?

I was just speaking to one of my devs about this today. Steve Jobs' turned Apple around by removing choice. You had a Consumer and Pro category and they each had a laptop and a desktop. The new Apple is slowly drifting into Dell territory, where I have too many options. It becomes the Netflix problem where I find myself having too many options, so I browse the offerings, and before I decide, fall asleep.

Steve Jobs got rid of a lot of stupid choices in the Mac line, but he was not anti choice.

At one point, the ipod lineup went from about $50 to $500 in $25-$50 increments. Every little increment was just that much better, in a way that made it very easy to spend a few more bucks. This one has more space, that one is a little bigger and has a screen, that one is a ton bigger an can play videos, this one has more storage than you'd ever imagine.

The ios lineup looked like that a few years back, between the ipod Touch, carrier subsidies for phones, and the new at the time ipads. The declining subsidies has cut off the 0$ upfront low end, but they're extending up with the pro.

My feeling on the laptops is that the Air is not long for this world (which sucks, cause I really like mine), and the model confusion now is essentially a transition state because they can't make all the engineering happen in one year. At some point, Apple is going to manage to make all of their laptops essentially iPads of different sizes, with attached keyboards.

(Why they can't do a bigger one with a real keyboard, days of battery life, and a monster processor is left to the imagination)

Re: New Windows 10 Devices From Microsoft

#934
post #851

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unabst was apparently of the opinion (above and in his deleted message) that the lack of innovation in the headline was much more significant than the massive innovation in the product. Seems to me that if Apple had produced the Surface Book, Mac fans would be wetting themselves so hard that a lot of people would drown....

Please stop putting words in my mouth or those of Mac fans. I stated a simple fact, but got downvoted, so I gave up. Glad you admitted there was a lack of innovation somewhere though. > Mac fans would be wetting themselves so hard that a lot of people would drown @IkmoIkmo How is that for bias?

> How is that for bias?

I stated a simple fact. Well, I assume that's how you would describe it ;-)

Re: New Windows 10 Devices From Microsoft

#935
post #298

Not different than most current offers on laptops, the keyboard still looks horrible for programming[1]. Fn keys shared with Home/End/PgUp/PgDwn, Up/Down arrows sharing a key. I guess they call it "slick", I call it won't buy. [1] ok, depending on what you are programming, I'm sure there will be people saying they only need the "0" and "1" keys working.

I don't like where they're placed on my keyboard either, so I use AutoHotkey to bind those functions to alt+arrows. Alt+up for page up, alt+down for page down, alt+left for home and alt+right for end. After a couple hours it became muscle memory again.

If you're using a Surface Pro, try pressing Fn + Arrow keys instead.

Re: New Windows 10 Devices From Microsoft

#936
post #655

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Let's say we're talking about ThinkPad T.. Which model? > T440p, T450, T450s, T540p, or T550? T450s. When looking for a competitor to Apple, go for the T-series, but also take a look at the X-series. T5XX has 15" screen and numpad in the keyboard, so unless you like numpad, forget those. 440 is the older series, before it there was 430 series, and presently 450 is the current line. "p" stands for "performance", bas…

> Also Apple makes do with just the integrated Intel graphics, so we don't need NDIVIA either. No they don't… the 15" MBP has a dedicated GPU, and a good one at that.

A good one ? Nope, not for the price.

http://www.notebookcheck.net/AMD-Radeon-R9-M370X.142763.0.ht... The AMD Radeon R9 M370X is a mid-range graphics card for laptops that was announced mid 2015.

Mac are awesome for work (mine at least) but useless for anything that requires a good gpu

Re: New Windows 10 Devices From Microsoft

#937

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> PowerShell = bash While a great fan of PowerShell in theory , in practice it seems to be extremely cumbersome. Sort of the opposite of bash and other Unix shells, which suck in theory and are very useful/convenient/powerful in practice.

Powershell is great, it lets you hack into almost any machine and take control of it, incredibly easily.

Bollocks.

Re: New Windows 10 Devices From Microsoft

#938
post #674

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, with just grep and curl, it'd be something like: curl http://slashdot.org/ | grep -o "href=[\"'][^\"']*" | sed -e "s/href=\"//" But presumably this is being discounted due to the lack of HTML parsing, so not the same as the Powershell example. Then one somewhat ugly method would be using the html xml utilities provided by the W3C and available on most package managers: curl http://slashdot.org/ | hxpipe 2> /dev…

Yes, a naive grep will pick up variables named href in JS, the text content of a div that contains "href", an href attribute on a non-anchor element, etc. so a utility that specifically parses HTML is necessary, but not sufficient. I'm not sure how robust your hxpipe example is against those.

It's a shell script. If you're architecturing more than that in your shell script, I would suggest that you shouldn't be doing this in a terminal in the first place. And if you're just trying to click links for a quick shell script, why not just do it via wget in the first place, rather than have this intermediate list of strings?

But since you asked, hxpipe assumes that href on a non anchor tag is an error and should be represented as an Ahref... which isn't too bad an assumption to make, tbf. The other situations is dealt with (text content, javascript).

Re: New Windows 10 Devices From Microsoft

#939
post #270

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I found compiling on Windows always a bit of a PITA. On Linux I just install build-essentials and everything works fine. On Windows I had to install a specific version of VS and fiddle around with the path to get things running. But maybe there is something like the build-essentials package in chocolatey? The terminal command history also feels strange. But I like cls more than clear, haha :D

I use msys and mingw for Windows compilation. It's so much easier than Visual Studio --- no messing about with stupid configuration panes and easily scriptable. I also get to use the same makefiles as the Unix port of my program. The only difficulty is that msys doesn't support parallel make, so builds are fairly slow, but my program's small and I do most of my development on Linux, so I don't care. (As an additional…

Oh, so I can use gcc to build on AND for Windows?

Re: New Windows 10 Devices From Microsoft

#940
post #896
post #717

When I got my first MacBook back in 2008, it was a revolution for me. The industrial design, the multitouch trackpad that actually worked 100% of the time, the backlit keyboard, the battery life, the trackpad-friendly OS -- these all worked together to make me wonder how other laptop manufacturers had got it so astoundingly wrong. I haven't had that feeling since then. Sure, the MacBook Air came out and it was amazin…

I was never particularly sold on MacBooks, probably because I was used to always building my own machines and the costs of MacBooks never felt like they were justified in any way regardless of pollish. The Surface Book looks like the first laptop I've ever seen that makes me think it might be worth it and it may be one of the first laptops to ever have an upgradeable internal GPU since the base could be switched out…

I was initially quite excited but the $1500 version doesn't have a dedicated GPU. It's still a pretty sweet laptop that should outperform a MBP, but then a MBP is $1300. That's a justified price difference I think, the SB has touch, pen and tablet functionality, too, plus better performance (MS claims), for $200, that's not a bad deal (unlike the iPad Pro, the pen - and obviously the keyboard - is included in the price!). Still, if you actually want the GPU you'd have to pay up $1900, at that point it gets kinda steep although that's true for the competition as well, plus your storage is doubled together with the GPU for that price. (can we all laugh at the MBP 15' at $2k that doesn't have a dedicated GPU for a moment :p?)

I totally agree with the MBP's value not being fully justified, at least until recently. I felt like that for years (~15 years of Windows user here), until I recently needed OS X for work and looked at the market more closely. I find that where I live (which reflects the international market pretty well), if you buy a $1500 Windows laptop, 4 years later people look at it as if it has no value and offer like $200 for it. For a MBP, it's more like $600. These things just retain value incredibly well and I'm stupefied to see some of the prices, e.g. yesterday I saw a guy ask $800 for a 2010 MBP (yeah the default one without an SSD, 4gb of ram, an intel core duo and 1280x800 display), it's just ridiculous but people actually buy those things. A 5 year old laptop - i.e. battery is shit and parts could start dying within 1-2 years - that has worse specs than brand new laptops at the same price, yet people buy it, in this case for something like 50% the original price, that's just ridiculous. Reminds me of that time I bought an iPod touch for music (2nd hand), and 18 months later sold it for the same amount, basically had a free mp3 player for a while. These things retaining value means a ton for my buying decision.

That fact right there means I'm, in effect, comparing a $1500 MBP to a $1500 Windows laptop, only the MBP in comparison would only cost me $1100 compared to the full $1500 for the Windows laptop. The Dell XPS 13 non-touch for example is $1k and that has a lower resolution, worse battery, worse cpu/gpu and half the storage, obviously, to a $1300 MBP, yet given the resale value of the two the MBP's lifetime value should be cheaper for the average person. That's why I ultimately bought the MBP (mostly for work, but also because taking into account the 2nd hand selling value shifted the economics such that it made the price justifiable)

The Surface Book feels like it might be different as it's got potential to become a solid 'real brand' that should retain value for quite some time. If I put a Dell XPS 13 on a second hand website, most people considering to buy a 2nd hand laptop (like my dad) haven't a clue that it's an amazing machine, especially 4 years after launch, because it's not a distinct enough brand. But even my dad who has never used an Apple device in his life thinks Apple means quality and knows about the Macbook brand and would pay up for one. The Surface Book seems to me to have a shot of becoming such a brand that everyone heard about and knows works really well and that could be sold for at least 30%-40% four years after launch like Macbooks. But apart from that, the economics of windows second hand laptops never looked good, maybe with the alienware/razer series as a niche exception.

I think you're right on switching out the base, that must be possible if MS wanted to make it possible, but that may be unlikely. One is that it's going to be much more expensive as the base probably has battery packs, cooling and a keyboard in there, alongside of course the actual casing. So for every GPU you buy, you're also buying all of that. With economics like that, it'd probably be a niche demand for a few people who are rich enough to do that, that MS won't be bothered to cater to, as these people are rich enough to buy a new device, too. Two is that cooling & power in such a small and enclosed device might become an issue when you bump up the card, although part of that (better cooling, more battery) is probably in the base so it could be co-upgraded, but that goes back to expense. And three is that it might not make a ton of sense. i.e. the on-board GPU of a 6th gen intel CPU is already pretty damn good, powers 4K, photo and video editing etc. So any dedicated card they do put in should probably be really good, and any upgrade of that that's worth ditching that, plus buying an even better card, plus the rest of an entire new base (keyboard, battery packs etc), would probably then cause CPU to be a bottleneck for practical applications. (i.e. when the CPU is made for the onboard GPU, then the GPU becomes dedicated, an upgrade of that dedicated GPU might create too much of an imbalance where the GPU outperforms the CPU and the latter bottlenecks the former.) Finally it doesn't feel like companies are excited to facilitate this usergroup much, everything seems to be moving towards non-exchangeable.

What if it worked the other way around though... Think about it, the default model's base has a keyboard and some battery packs and no GPU. Now what if I wanted to buy the Surface Book 2? Well nevermind the base, I just want to buy the new tablet and put it on my old base, then give my old tablet to my kid, a friend, sell it 2nd hand. That way you can upgrade the screen, the cpu, gpu, the ram, the storage etc, while using the same keyboard and battery packs. There are some reasons why this won't happen but this might make more sense to a larger amount of users than the niche who wants to switch out their laptop's dedicated GPU every few years.

Post reply on HN