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Miscellanea: The War in Iran

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Re: Miscellanea: The War in Iran

#921
post #813
post #673

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those days people that hate Jews claiming they're "only anti-Zionists" are being white washed while synagogues are shot at and people displaying anything Jewish are attacked on the streets in western countries. Antisemitism is at all times high. And not the "critical of Israel" type of antisemitism. The "jews control the weather", "space lasers from mars" and "let's kill all of them" type of antisemitism is rampant.…

>Those days people that hate Jews claiming they're "only anti-Zionists" That's mainly what the more racist zionists claim. Most genuine anti semites are up front about their distaste for Jews and they tend to be on the far, far right. There's a simple test to distinguish the genuine anti racists and the disguised racists, too: * I condemn the holocaust unreservedly. It was commited by a regime of absolute evil agains…

Here I'm not ignoring you though I probably should.

The problem is you're providing cover for the antisemites even if you're not one yourself (which isn't clear at this point). They will fly under your cover pretending that they actually care about the same thing. We see this "mix" in the conversation (e.g. painting the Jews in the US as not being loyal or serving foreign interests).

The choice of the word "genocide" for the civilians killed in the war in Gaza is antisemitism. You might not think so but it objectively is. That word started getting used around 5 minutes into this war on Oct 8th or so. The Israeli "regime" (aka democratically elected government) is not absolute evil and it is fighting a war against a mix of innocent people and evil people which is true for most wars. While elements of this government may hold opinions that are let's say "extreme" that is different than evil. Evil is what Hamas' attack on Oct 7th looked like. Anyways, evil is meant to manipulate emotions as is genocide. Those are tools of propaganda and their usage indicates a certain mindset. The word genocide is not appropriate because it refers to the aim of destroying a national or ethnic group and Gaza is neither. Even if Israel wanted to kill, and killed, all Gazans that does not fit the commonly accepted definition of this word prior to the war in Gaza. Those that wield the word rely on some legalities that differ from the common usage and that is intentional. According to certain legal scholars even the killing of a single person can be considered a genocide but that's obviously not what the intent is/was. So the usage of this word is a "tell" in a bad way and the singling out of Israel is another "tell". There are ways of expressing your condemnation that would probably avoid the issue and the choices made do matter. The problem is then you'd actually have to say what you really think and that might not stand a test to the factual reality. You might have to also suggest what Israel could have done that would be acceptable to your morals and is something that stands other tests of reason.

The equating/comparison of the war in Gaza to the Holocaust is antisemitism.

The war in Gaza is not a "UN recognized genocide" and that title is meaningless anyways. We don't need to UN to tell us what's right and what's wrong.

There are many examples current and historical where more civilians were harmed, with more intent, and less or no reasons, that haven't drawn the kind of hate and condemnation that is aimed at Israel (or as you say the "regime" whatever that's supposed to mean). That "bias" is what racism and antisemitism is partly about.

So you are clearly possessed of this bias. I claim I have no bias. If you s/Palestinians/Swedes/ and s/Israel/Dutch/ my take on the Gaza war would be exactly the same. I do not view it through a lens of race. I view it purely through the facts of the matter. Any similar example in the world, any other war or conflict, with civilian casualties, I would view through the very same lens. No racism. Maybe you don't know that in every war ever innocent people die. Maybe you don't understand the realities and facts of this specific war. Maybe you don't understand the propaganda war going on. I really don't know. What I do know is that there is a correlation between physical attacks on Jews all over the world and this intentionally distorted view of the conflict so even if you claim that you support one and oppose the other that's clearly not how many people perceive the same propaganda.

Re: Miscellanea: The War in Iran

#922
post #673

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those days people that hate Jews claiming they're "only anti-Zionists" are being white washed while synagogues are shot at and people displaying anything Jewish are attacked on the streets in western countries. Antisemitism is at all times high. And not the "critical of Israel" type of antisemitism. The "jews control the weather", "space lasers from mars" and "let's kill all of them" type of antisemitism is rampant.…

Yes and why do you think that is. Constant crying wolf means moderate persons are slowly feeling the word antisemite lose all meaning and therefore the real antisemites are gaining room to legitimise themselves.

I don't think we're crying wolf.

Part of the game played here by the people that hate Jews is to attack the meaning of this word and they are being successful at it. Distortion of words and language is part of the tool set used by the anti-Israel camp here. The anti-Israel camp, which is also (broadly) antisemitic, is intentionally fueling antisemitism while pushing the argument that it's not antisemitism because it's really anti-Zionism or anti-Israel.

For countries like Iran and Qatar Israel should not exist because it's Jewish and Jews should not live in the Middle East because it's Muslim land. In their eyes there is no confusion that these are all the same thing. Only in those eyes of said "moderate" people.

Re: Miscellanea: The War in Iran

#923
post #917
post #911

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're ignoring things I already stated, such as communism is an aspiration. So of course China is not realized communism, because communism has never been realized at the national scale. The people in charge however, are absolutely communists. Do you know why Hitler blamed the Jewish people and had them separated out? He blamed the Jewish Bolshevik revolutions in Germany for causing Germany to lose World War 1. Hitl…

> Do you know why Hitler blamed the Jewish people and had them separated out? Yes, Hitler did blood libel [1], a tradition continued by Donald Trump [2]. > He blamed the Jewish Bolshevik revolutions in Germany for causing Germany to lose World War 1 Are you arguing Hitler was right? Or that it was a useful tool and a lie? Because you've blamed the Communists for WW2. Multiple times. This makes me think you've been hi…

Racism was clearly an important aspect of Hitler's motivations and there is an important reason why. The reason racism is important, is because of communism. It would be outrageous to simply discard communism as if it was irrelevant, when these revolutions necessarily inflame these qualities in a society.

Communist revolution was not simply some kind of economic restructuring demand from workers. It is about eradicating religion and revolutionizing culture which in old countries is often tied to the culture of a genetic line of people. That is how inflammatory these Marxist revolutions are, that they bring rise to voices who want to reinvigorate a race and defend religion.

Marxist movements tend to redefine multiple angles of a people's identity. That's why there were also many similarities in Japan's fight against communism and its racial attributes. That's why you also see racial and religious qualities in the US rejection of Marxist tampering in culture today, though they are vastly overstated. Basically information moves so fast now, it's easier for people to see how dumb Marxism is if they weren't indoctrinated young, so plenty of reasonable people reject it without needing religious or racial angles fueling it. Despite that, it still spreads.

I do blame communists for World War 2, in combination with the power imbalances and massive opportunities that industrialization surfaced. Germany and Japan both believed they had larger potential in that environment, but communism gave them the legitimate enemy they needed to justify expanding. Essentially, global communism is about controlling all the resources and leveraging them, so any country that wants to survive outside of communism has to race for resources.

This isn't a neo-Nazi conspiracy theory, it's just history. It's a matter of history that there was an intention to expand communism globally. Look up Comintern if you've never heard of it, which advocated for world communism.

Re: Miscellanea: The War in Iran

#924
post #673

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those days people that hate Jews claiming they're "only anti-Zionists" are being white washed while synagogues are shot at and people displaying anything Jewish are attacked on the streets in western countries. Antisemitism is at all times high. And not the "critical of Israel" type of antisemitism. The "jews control the weather", "space lasers from mars" and "let's kill all of them" type of antisemitism is rampant.…

> Antisemitism is at all times high. It's always high, or did you mean at an all time high? How does antisemitism in America today compare to Russia in the 1800s?

Well it's hard to say. But I meant more or less since WW-II or modern times.

Re: Miscellanea: The War in Iran

#925
post #795
post #667

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Israel isn't "annexing southern Lebanon". Israel already controlled southern Lebanon and withdrew. Even recently Israel was deeper in southern Lebanon and withdrew - and is now paying the price for that. Israel was already in Beirut .. and not so long ago ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siege_of_Beirut ) Israel is pushing back Hezbollah that's attacking Israel's north. Hezbollah decided to join the war and it's firin…

And incidentally destroying all villages and emptying the area of all residents while they at it, then destroying the bridges that connect the region to the rest of the country. Katz is indeed still talking about a "buffer zone", while Smotrich demands a "permanent change of borders". The settler movement has already drawn maps. https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/israel-security/2026-03-... https://www.haaretz.com/i…

I meant to say if Israel really wanted it then it already had it.

It is a requirement under international law to let civilians evacuate areas where fighting is happening. If Israel accomodates that then they're engaging in ethnic cleansing. If they don't then they're engaging in genocide. Maybe the anti-Israelis should spell a more detailed and acceptable plan of how Israel can get Lebanon to stop lobbing rockets into its cities. If Hezbollah is using villages as cover then they become military objective. Check out what villages on the Ukraine/Russia frontlines look like or in any other war. Hezbollah fired hundreds of rockets already from inside the city of Tyre at Israel. Many armies would just flatten it with artillery under this situation.

Smotritch and the settler movement don't get to decide.

But yes, the argument that if Israel doesn't extract a price for aggression is gaining momentum over time. Because it seems nothing else works. Lebanon has no reason to attack Israel. It's not "occupied", it has no "right of resistance", or whatever other bullshit reasons people give to the right of others to lob rockets into Israeli population centers and terrorize its civilians. The Lebanese government gets it as well but unfortunately has no ability to control Hezbollah who are loyal to Iran.

Either way at this time it is not being annexed and there is no plan to annex it. What will likely happen is that some buffer zone will remain occupied until the Lebanese government and UN resolutions decisions demanding Hezbollah is disarmed are applied. If Hezbollah keeps rearming and keeps attacking Israel then we can expect that buffer zone to keep growing over the long term and the retaliation from Israel to become as severe as required to remove that threat. The main change in Israel's policy following Oct 7th is that it will not get into a scenario where it can be surprised again and it will not allow enemy forces to build up the capability to surprise it.

Re: Miscellanea: The War in Iran

#926

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right, 15 years ago in a recently heavily bombarded city 50% of children were born with defects, according to one study. Terrible even if off by an order of magnitude. Nothing in that document, or anything else I've found, supports the claim that today in Baghdad half of all children are dying from birth defects. Things were bad. Are still bad. But throwing around inaccurate numbers does not help matters.

>Right, 15 years ago in a recently heavily bombarded city 50% of children In a lot of the bombarded cities, not just Fallujah. Wherever US forces went they left a heinous legacy which is still paid for by the mothers of Iraq. >Baghdad There’s another study for Baghdad out there, I’ll link it if I can find it. >inaccurate numbers Straw man argument. The numbers are inaccurate because the studies are obfuscated by US-l…

50% of children dying at (or before) birth in a major city should be global news. I want it to be not true, but if it is true, I want someone to be talking about it.

I don't know what's so hard to understand about "this is a remarkable claim and requires some evidence". No one in this thread has supplied ANY evidence that it is true.

Re: Miscellanea: The War in Iran

#927

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would you say that the Vietnam War was a success for the US?

Indochina and SEA remained communist free ... according to the domino theory the whole point of USA involvement there was to contain the spread.

It failed to contain communism, though. Afterwards, communism spread to Cambodia; a direct domino effect of the US withdrawal.

Re: Miscellanea: The War in Iran

#928
post #61

He writes that the region is not very important to the USA. It's not, but it is a strategically important area, not only in terms of its location, at the nexus of Asia, Africa and Europe, but also because of the oil there. Now the US is not dependent on Middle Eastern Oil, but Japan, China and other countries are. So controlling the region will mean a lever of power over those regions.

At present, gasoline prices in China have risen by 11% since the war started. In the U.S., they have risen by 33%. The U.S. is dependent on oil and the oil market is global. Even if the U.S. is a net exporter of oil, Americans still pay increased prices for pretty much everything as a result and the economy suffers. The only way around this would be a scheme in which domestic oil producers are forced to sell to Ameri…

I don't interpret your statistic the same way you do and I don't think it backs your point. Some of the difference between that 11% and 33% you quote are due to the fact that gas is baseline cheaper in the US than China, and a mere denominator difference doesn't prove one more reliant than the other on gas when it goes up by a flat rate, which is how oil prices generally impact gas prices. Another factor you're failing to consider is the possibility that economic headwinds due to oil prices or any other factor really (you're trying to model an extremely complex system here and the war can affect these two economies in many other ways) impact Chinese demand for gas (driven by their mfg sector) more than American demand for gas (driven by broader factors) - maybe cargo price, currency, shift of demand from consumer to military, or who knows what are causing the things you see. I don't claim to have the answer, I am just saying your measure is totally insufficient to prove your point. You're correct that it's a global commodity that impacts everyone but most experts agree that it impacts east Asia more than the US.

Re: Miscellanea: The War in Iran

#929
post #922

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes and why do you think that is. Constant crying wolf means moderate persons are slowly feeling the word antisemite lose all meaning and therefore the real antisemites are gaining room to legitimise themselves.

I don't think we're crying wolf. Part of the game played here by the people that hate Jews is to attack the meaning of this word and they are being successful at it. Distortion of words and language is part of the tool set used by the anti-Israel camp here. The anti-Israel camp, which is also (broadly) antisemitic, is intentionally fueling antisemitism while pushing the argument that it's not antisemitism because it'…

No that's complete nonsense. In today's era actual antisemites won't need guesswork to locate, they'd openly vomit out a salad of zog, greedy bastards, traitors, that 109 country bs, holocaust denialism, etc etc. AIPAC for example has made the calculation that accusing moderate non-racists of antisemitism is much more effective than doing anything about actual hardcore antisemites whom they ignore. Actions like this are the reason words like ZOG are slowly becoming used in the mainstream. The accusation of antisemitism is losing all meaning.

Arabic countries didn't have much trouble coexisting with native jews. You might be overlooking the minor point of shipping Europeans en-masse into a place and displacing people who lived there before natively.

Re: Miscellanea: The War in Iran

#930
post #752

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That doesn't exactly limit the impact of cutting off the supply. It's a global trade market. If China buys on the global market from other places instead of Iran because that oil isn't available, that still creates a shortage for everyone and that still pushes up the price of oil for everyone.

Sure. But the US has substantial domestic production. So China (and everyone else who has to import the majority of their oil) gets hurt more.

...and of course the US has a lot of other industries that are hurt by this: https://www.npr.org/2026/03/26/g-s1-115240/iran-war-strait-h...
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