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GPT-4.5

openai.com

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Re: GPT-4.5

#921

Cathartic moment over.

why did you remove the comment . now who ppl responded to you look like dummies. do you do this sort of stuff in real life too?

What would it mean to do this in real life? :D

I regularly make knee-jerk comments on HN that I delete a minute later. Something therapeutic about it.

My comment isn't one I wanted on my "record". You responded to it and I saw your response before deleting my comment. What's the harm? It's obvious I removed my comment.

Re: GPT-4.5

#922
post #867

Just going to put this here: https://www.wheresyoured.at/wheres-the-money/

"There Is No AI Revolution" Good write-up. But it focuses too much on the big companies. Many indiehackers have figured out how to make profit with AI: 1. No free tier. Just provide a good landing page. 2. Ship fast. Ship iteratively. Employ no one besides yourself. 3. Profit. The old silicon valley idea that you need to raise a bunch of money, hire a bunch of devs, and scale a ton to satisfy investors is dying rapid…

If this were true wouldn't we be seeing a massive devaluation of software? (or alternatively increased demand for complex software)

Re: GPT-4.5

#923
post #26

GPT 4.5 pricing is insane: Price Input: $75.00 / 1M tokens Cached input: $37.50 / 1M tokens Output: $150.00 / 1M tokens GPT 4o pricing for comparison: Price Input: $2.50 / 1M tokens Cached input: $1.25 / 1M tokens Output: $10.00 / 1M tokens It sounds like it's so expensive and the difference in usefulness is so lacking(?) they're not even gonna keep serving it in the API for long: > GPT‑4.5 is a very large and comput…

My understanding is that o1 is a system built on GPT-4o, so this pricing might explain why o3 (the alleged full version) cost so much money to run in the published benchmark tests [0]. It must be using GPT 4.5 or something similar as the underlying model.

[0] https://arcprize.org/blog/oai-o3-pub-breakthrough

Re: GPT-4.5

#924
post #565

Cathartic moment over.

I haven't had the same experience. Here are some of the significant issues when using o1 or claude 3.7 with vscode copilot: * Very wreckless in pulling in third party libraries - often pulling in older versions including packages that trigger vulnerability warnings in package managers like npm. Imagine a student or junior developer falling into this trap. * Very wreckless around data security. For example in an estab…

I've been using it daily for years. Mostly asking questions in a separate chat window/app and then working its response into my code. And then I sped up the feedback loop when I migrated to Cursor where I began pushing the envelop and asking it to do more.

I think what wears off is that we're less impressed and then we start demanding more and more from it and getting frustrating when it can't do it. But that's different than a honeymoon phase wearing off. It's like how we're not really impressed by image gen anymore, we expect it.

But as an example of a selfish sense of loss I've experienced, I used to pride myself in being the only developer on any team who ever learned CSS. I could architect a good grid/flex layout with a lot of thought. I could do little things like make text in a small UI component truncate into {3 letters} + ellipses when its parent was too small. And most of all I could polish UIs to a point where I'd say they were perfect, even a form.

Now, LLMs are really good at doing the mechanical parts of the things I spent so much time learning. Like I originally said, I'm not shedding tears over here saying it's so unfair. But there is a sense of loss. And when I figured most people reading my comment would misinterpret this, I removed my comment. Because you can't make descriptive claims about how you feel online, it can only be interpreted as a normative value judgement about the world. Because I guess that's what it is 99.9% of the time someone expresses a feeling they feel, but not in this case.

Finally, the right way to see it is that now I can polish the UI to perfection, but I don't need to be a CSS expert anymore. Nobody needs to be. You can get an idea of how you want the UI to work and ask the LLM "make this one bit of text be the one that truncates if the window is too narrow" and it does it. And that's fkin magic.

Re: GPT-4.5

#925

Earlier quoted context omitted.

it was never fair to call them stochastic parrots and anybody who is paying any attention knows that sequence models can generalize at least partially OOD

Or equivalently, it vastly underestimates the intelligence of parrots

Anyone who has studied Monte Carlo methods and stochastic differential equations and their applications and stochastic algorithms never found “stochastic parrot” a pejorative. In a very real way determinism is a requirement for a small mind that can’t get comfortable or understand advanced probability theory and its application.

Re: GPT-4.5

#926

Is it official then? Most of us have been waiting for this moment for a while. The transformer architecture as it is currently understood can't be milked any further. Many of us knew this since last year. GPT-5 delays eventually led to non-tech voices to suggest likewise. But we all held our final decision until the next big release from OpenAI as Sam Altman has been making claims about AGI entering the workforce thi…

lol this isn’t a reasoning model, those are doing very well, but cute essay you wrote there

Re: GPT-4.5

#927

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's worth pointing out that GPT-4.5 seems focused on better pre-training and doesn't include reasoning. I think GPT-5 - if/when it happens - will be 4.5 with reasoning, and as such it will feel very different. The barrier, is the computational cost of it. Once 4.5 gets down to similar costs to 4.0 - which could be achieved through various optimization steps (what happened to the ternary stuff that was published last…

Is it fair to still call LLMs stochastic parrots now that they are enriched with reasoning? Seems to me that the simple procedure of large-scale sampling + filtering makes it immediately plausible to get something better than the training distribution out of the LLM. In that sense the parrot metaphor seems suddenly wrong. I don’t feel like this binary shift is adequately accounted for among the LLM cynics.

They are not enriched with reasoning, it's just snake oil, I'm afraid.

Re: GPT-4.5

#928
The high price is there to ensure nobody thinks of distilling their own cheap model using 4.5. OpenAI will undoubtedly distill a mini version themselves and they want to be out front for that benefit.

Re: GPT-4.5

#929

I'm one week in on heavy grok usage. I didn't think I'd say this, but for personal use, I'm considering cancelling my OpenAI plan. The one thing I wish grok had was more separation of the UI from X itself. The interface being so coupled to X puts me off and makes it feel like a second-hand citizen. I like ChatGPTs minimalist UI.

I canceled my GPT, Grok is incredible.

Re: GPT-4.5

#930
post #26

GPT 4.5 pricing is insane: Price Input: $75.00 / 1M tokens Cached input: $37.50 / 1M tokens Output: $150.00 / 1M tokens GPT 4o pricing for comparison: Price Input: $2.50 / 1M tokens Cached input: $1.25 / 1M tokens Output: $10.00 / 1M tokens It sounds like it's so expensive and the difference in usefulness is so lacking(?) they're not even gonna keep serving it in the API for long: > GPT‑4.5 is a very large and comput…

The price is obviously 15-30x that of 4o, but I'd just posit that there are some use cases where it may make sense. It probably doesn't make sense for the "open-ended consumer facing chatbot" use case, but for other use cases that are fewer and higher value in nature, it could if it's abilities are considerably better than 4o. For example, there are now a bunch of vendors that sell "respond to RFP" AI products. The n…

Complete legal arguments as well. If I was an attorney, I'd love to have a sophisticated LLM write my crib notes for anything I might do or say in the court room, or even the complete direction that I'd take my case. For some cases, that'd be worth almost any price.
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