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Netflix buffering issues: Boxing fans complain about Jake Paul vs. Mike Tyson

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Re: Netflix buffering issues: Boxing fans complain about Jake Paul vs. Mike Tyson

#921

Post by xyst »

Xenoamorphous wrote: post #608
xyst wrote: post #587

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are making excuses for a multibillion dollar company that has been in this game for many years. Maybe the first to market in streaming. This isn’t NFLX’s first rodeo in live streaming. Have seen a handful of events pop up in their apps. There is no excuse. All of the resources and talent at their disposal, and they looked absolutely amateurish. Poor optics. I would be amazed if they are able to secure another exc…

Sorry for the off topic but what’s this thing that I only come across in Hacker News about referring to a company by their stock exchange name (APPL, MSFT, etc) outside of a stock context? It seems really weird to me.

I used to gather fringe signals for shitty hedge funds, “fintech” from public communities such as HN.

I think I subconsciously adopted it since it made my job easier. Sort of how I use YYYYMMDD format in almost everything from programming to daily communication.

Re: Netflix buffering issues: Boxing fans complain about Jake Paul vs. Mike Tyson

#922

Post by xyst »

School-Cotton wrote: post #659
Xenoamorphous wrote: post #608

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry for the off topic but what’s this thing that I only come across in Hacker News about referring to a company by their stock exchange name (APPL, MSFT, etc) outside of a stock context? It seems really weird to me.

In-group signaling for people who like playing or thinking about the stock market. Similar to how people who make travel a big part of their identity refer to cities by their airport code.

not really. It’s just something I adopted as part of a job I had for fintech 3-4 yrs ago

I don’t do it as some sort of “signaling” for “fintech bros” or anything like that

Re: Netflix buffering issues: Boxing fans complain about Jake Paul vs. Mike Tyson

#923

Post by freefaler »

patrick451 wrote: post #917
freefaler wrote: post #588

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is that provisioning vast capacity for peak viewership is expensive and requires long-term commitment. Some providers won't give you more connectivity to their network unless you sign a 12 month deal where you prepay that. Peak traffic is very expensive to run, because you're building capacity that will be empty/unsused when the event ends. Who'd pay for that? That's why it's tricky and that's why Akamai…

What's your point? If they couldn't manage to secure the resources necessary, they shouldn't have agreed to livestream it. As a customer, I don't care AT ALL if it's difficult.

As a customer you're right that you don't care. As a company you care for the cost of the product you sell. Companies doesn't care about "the customer" per se, they care about their profit margin and "free market" competition pushes them to lower the price and keep the service level good. Exclusive rights to stream the fight? Well... it better be working, but we won't overprovision and pay over the expected return.

Buying the exclusive rights for 20Mil and puting 30Mil to stream it wouldn't be a very smart choice. Fuckups happen and this might be a mistake that cost them in lost reputation more than they expected to win.

Re: Netflix buffering issues: Boxing fans complain about Jake Paul vs. Mike Tyson

#924

Post by YZF »

ta1243 wrote: post #895
YZF wrote: post #645

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Edge caches are not useless for live streaming. They're critical. The upstream from those caches has no way of handling each individual users. The stream needs to hit the edge cache and end users should be served from there. A typical streaming architecture is multi-tiered caches, source->midtier->edge. We don't know what happened but it's possible they ran out of capacity on their edge (or anywhere else).

BBC had a similar issue in a live stream 5 years ago where events conspired and a CDN "failed open", which effectively DOSsed the entire output via all CDNs > Even though widely used, this pattern has some significant drawbacks, the best illustration being the major incident that hit the BBC during the 2018 World Cup quarter-final. Our routing component experienced a temporary wobble which had a knock-on effect and c…

This feels like a bug in the implementation and not really a drawback of the pattern. "Routing component experienced a temporary wobble" also sounds like bug of sorts.

I worked in this space. All these potential failure modes and how they're mitigates is something that we paid a fair amount of attention to.

Re: Netflix buffering issues: Boxing fans complain about Jake Paul vs. Mike Tyson

#925

Post by wlonkly »

ilrwbwrkhv wrote: post #778
dpkirchner wrote: post #704

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right? A common complaint by outsiders is that Netflix uses microservices. I'd love to hear exactly how a monolith application is guaranteed to perform better, with details . What is the magic difference that would have ensured the live stream would have been successful?

I am one of the ones who complain about their microservices architecture quite a lot. This comes from both first-hand experience of talking to several of their directors when consulted upon on how to make certain systems of theirs better. It's not just a matter of guarantees, it's a matter of complexity. Like right now Google search is dying and there's nothing that they can do to fix it because they have given up co…

They want to be associated with FAANG? What does the N stand for?

Re: Netflix buffering issues: Boxing fans complain about Jake Paul vs. Mike Tyson

#926

Post by jiggawatts »

otterley wrote: post #910
jiggawatts wrote: post #865

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Money was not "free". Borrowing costs went to nearly zero. That's not the same thing. You have to repay the money , you just don't have to repay it with interest . I would have assumed people generally know this, but everybody (and I do mean everybody) talks like they don't know this. I would like to assume that "money is free" is just a shorthand, buuuut... again... these arguments! People like that EM talk like it…

Companies weren’t issuing debt to pay for headcount. The reason market interest rates matter is that when interest rates are low, your company stock doesn’t have to have high returns to get investment. When these conditions exist, companies feel safer hiring people to invest in growth instead of saving to provide high shareholder returns. I highly recommend everyone take a university-level financial instruments cours…

So you’re saying the investors are happy to see their money set on fire?

Surely they expect at a minimum that their capital investment would make them dividends (increased revenue), and also that the money wasn’t simply set on fire with nothing to show for it and no way to repay it.

If I’m wrong then Twitter - and similar companies - are little better than Ponzi schemes, with investors relying on the money of the greater fool to recover their money.

Re: Netflix buffering issues: Boxing fans complain about Jake Paul vs. Mike Tyson

#927

Post by w0mbat »

kmeisthax wrote: post #843
survirtual wrote: post #733

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For an event like this, there already exists an architecture that can handle boundless scale: torrents. If you code it to utilize high-bandwidth users upload, the service becomes more available as more users are watching -- not less available. It becomes less expensive with scale, more available, more stable. The be more specific, if you encode the video in blocks with each new block hash being broadcast across the n…

Yes, and then some idiot with an axe to grind against Logan Paul starts DDoSing people in the Netflix swarm, kicking them out of the livestream. This is always a problem because torrents, by design , are privacy-hostile. That's how the MAFIAA[1] figured out you were torrenting movies in 2004 and how they sent your ISP a takedown notice. Hell, in the US, this setup might actually be illegal because of the VPPA[0]. The…

Tyson was fighting Jake Paul, not Logan Paul. That’s Jake’s brother.

Re: Netflix buffering issues: Boxing fans complain about Jake Paul vs. Mike Tyson

#928

Post by yearolinuxdsktp »

vel0city wrote: post #906
yearolinuxdsktp wrote: post #803

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://www.cabletv.com/blog/why-people-still-pay-for-cable says it’s inertia, live sports and ease of use. Don’t act so surprised—-streaming is a pain in the ass to figure out. People have been trained to tolerate a 3-second UI lag for every button press (seemingly all cable boxes are godawfully shitty like this—-it must be the server-side UI rendering design?) BUT! You can record your game and the cable TV DVR is d…

I last regularly used a DirecTV DVR. There were a surprising number of times where it wouldn't let me fast forward through ads. Not only that, sometimes it would connect out to the internet to download new targeted forced ads on stuff that was recorded a while ago.

The horrors! I stand corrected. :(

Re: Netflix buffering issues: Boxing fans complain about Jake Paul vs. Mike Tyson

#929

Post by colesantiago »

jhugo wrote: post #864
colesantiago wrote: post #473

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The evidence is that the stream went down. We will see why it went down and to what extent they underinvested in their post mortem.

That’s not evidence for the assertion you made.

Other potential and future entertainment partners Netflix will be working with e.g. WWE, will certainly see my view as they will be questioning Netflix's capability after that major streaming issue we both saw.

This isn't Netflix's first time they had this live streaming problem.

People will see this as an underinvestment from Netflix's part and they will reconsider going to a different streaming partner.

Re: Netflix buffering issues: Boxing fans complain about Jake Paul vs. Mike Tyson

#930

Post by johnnyanmac »

shermantanktop wrote: post #698

Every time a big company screws up, there are two highly informed sets of people who are guaranteed to be lurking, but rarely post, in a thread like this: 1) those directly involved with the incident, or employees of the same company. They have too much to lose by circumventing the PR machine. 2) people at similar companies who operate similar systems with similar scale and risks. Those people know how hard this is a…

I'm sure 2) can post. But it won't be popular, so you'll need to dig to find it.

Most people are consumers and at the end of the day, their ability to consume a (boring) match was disrupted. If this was PPV (I don't think it is) the paid extra to not get the quality of product they expected. I'm not surprised they dominate the conversation.

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