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Women are nearly half of new gun buyers, study finds

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Re: Women are nearly half of new gun buyers, study finds

#921

Post by MagnumOpus »

tablespoon wrote: post #833
stefan_ wrote: post #669

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's doubly ironic because of course a large swath of the guns in what is bordering on civil war in Mexico are supplied by the US, made possible through the (lack of) gun ownership regulation.

> It's doubly ironic because of course a large swath of the guns in what is bordering on civil war in Mexico are supplied by the US, made possible through the (lack of) gun ownership regulation. If the cartels can ship large amounts of highly illegal cargo transnationally and setup infrastructure like their own private cellular networks, I think they'd be able to acquire all the guns they need even if the US had stri…

> the cartels

"The cartels" is not a single organisation. Yes the largest best-organised gangs could build firearms factories - or more realistically just bribe some soldiers or cops to "lose" a few truckloads of weapons, just like they do with automatic weapons right now.

But there is a huge difference in a weapon being available by the dozens to the highest tier of the top 2-3 cartels (like machine guns or rocket launchers or IFVs are right now), and a weapon being available by the hundred thousands for anyone with a few dollars to their name!

Re: Women are nearly half of new gun buyers, study finds

#922

Post by MagnumOpus »

NoImmatureAdHom wrote: post #724
sho_hn wrote: post #666

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's the same in the US, and basically every country in the world. Some places are dangerous, others aren't. No, it's really not. I spent a number of years living in Seoul, and you can have a 25 million people metro area with virtually no areas you wouldn't go to alone at night. They may exist, somewhere, but you really have to struggle to find them. That plus no loud and aggressive people on the streets, basically…

Idk why the downvotes for orangepurple, that is basically correct. Heterogeneous societies are much harder to govern. Different kinds of people living side-by-side fight. The calmest, most in-control societies around the world are homogeneous. SK, NK, and Japan are the most ethnically homogeneous countries on earth. Oh, and SK is an oligarchy. Essentially everything is run by a handful of families (those who run the…

> Different kinds of people living side-by-side fight. The calmest, most in-control societies around the world are homogeneous.

Switzerland. 3-4 ethnic groups with entirely different languages as well as quite different wealth levels, managing to go without massacres and civil wars for hundreds of years. (So that their different wealth levels now look like the difference between "well-off" and "filthy rich" to their neighbours...)

Re: Women are nearly half of new gun buyers, study finds

#923

Post by indymike »

OrvalWintermute wrote: post #788
cmrdporcupine wrote: post #663

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US has the gun fetish because it has a perpetual racialized underclass, among other reasons. You're right the violence is tied to its history. But so are the guns. You cannot separate the two. As others have pointed out; personal firearms are pretty useless as a vehicle for resisting state oppression and tyranny. But they're useful for stopping slave revolts or, more contemporarily, guarding your McMansion. The p…

> The US has the gun fetish because it has a perpetual racialized underclass, among other reasons. You're right the violence is tied to its history. But so are the guns. You cannot separate the two. The American gun fetish dates back to the earliest arrivals in the New World, in all areas of the country, both initial northern states, and later southern states, and the West. If you haven't spent enough time in the wil…

People get way too wound up over guns. This is a rural/urban issue. Where I live (edge of civilization) the police response time is around 20 minutes. That is too long to deter or prevent most crime. So most rural people own a gun or two and for some reason the bad guys don't mess with us much. Taking my gun rights away makes my family a lot less safe so...

> You might seek to grasp a true understanding of the culture involved

Please do the same. Your entire post is dripping with an urban elitism and does not show any hint that you might consider someone else's point of view. Enjoy that coffee.

Re: Women are nearly half of new gun buyers, study finds

#924

Post by MagnumOpus »

ApolloFortyNine wrote: post #896
kelnos wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Inalienable rights preceed government, they are not granted by it. That's a nice ideal, but in reality governments can do and take away whatever they want, and a guarantee that they won't take away your "inalienable" rights is only as good as the system built around that government, and the willingness of its people to fight (physically or legally) for their rights.

The right to freedom of speech in the US is almost truly uninhibited. Even the "you can't yell fire in a crowded theater" argument was actually revisited by the Supreme Court and thrown out. If there's an amendment to the constitution to ban owning a firearm, so be it. But if that right is severely limited without an amendment, it would be natural to fear for the rest. The verbiage on the first 10 amendments is incre…

There is often a disconnect between what is the constitution/the law, and what the people in power actually order their cops/soldiers to do.

The constitution of the USSR guaranteed the privacy of citizens' communications, freedom of religion, and doesn't just allow citizens to criticize public organizations but prohibits persecution of critics. You know what happened in reality.

The US is by no means immune to that - we've seen last year that the President can easily send some of the millions of armed people he has under his direct control to crack down on protests and disappear some people -- while the constitutional legitimacy gets debated months later once the damage is done...

Re: Women are nearly half of new gun buyers, study finds

#925

Post by throw0101a »

worrycue wrote: post #877
beerandt wrote: post #653

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is like claiming people get in car accidents during every single driving trip, because accident reports fail to ever mention drivers reaching their destination safely and without incident.

Is having a gun in your purse really going to protect you from getting mugged? The person mugging you surely realises there is a possibility you have a gun and will shoot the moment he/she thinks you are pulling a gun out. Attackers always have first mover advantage and be better able to utilise their weapons.

> The person mugging you surely realises there is a possibility you have a gun and will shoot the moment he/she thinks you are pulling a gun out.

There's a study bearing this out:

> Results. After adjustment, individuals in possession of a gun were 4.46 (P

* https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2759797/

* https://dx.doi.org/10.2105%2FAJPH.2008.143099

Re: Women are nearly half of new gun buyers, study finds

#926

Post by Symbiote »

NoImmatureAdHom wrote: post #736
philwelch wrote: post #422

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not actually sure how accurate that is. France has an ethnically and religiously heterogeneous population, high levels of immigration from Africa, and open borders with the rest of the EU.

Open borders with the rest of the EU is...Spain, Germany, Switzerland, Belgium. And adorable Andorra. Oh, and Italy. All of which are comparable to Mexico where it counts, of course. /s

There are usually no border controls from France as far as the EU borders with Russia, Belarus, Ukraine, Serbia and Andorra.

Romania and Bulgaria's borders seem fairly porous, and Bulgaria borders Turkey.

There is a marine border with North Africa, which is probably the closest equivalent to the US/Mexico border.

Re: Women are nearly half of new gun buyers, study finds

#927

Post by giantg2 »

seoaeu wrote: post #815
giantg2 wrote: post #734

Earlier quoted context omitted.

" the US military would crush them in a heartbeat " I think what we've seen in prior civil wars is that portions of the military will support both sides.

Then what are private firearms needed for? The local arsenal filled with assault rifles and rocket launchers is going to be a way better option...

Taking on the government isn't the reason most people own guns. There are other much more common reasons such as sport, hunting, self defense, etc. That said, if the armories are only stocked for roughly the population of the military, then there's little chance of arming a significant number of civilians that way. Not to mention the logistics would be a nightmare. The real usefulness of civilians owning weapons in that sort of scenario would be self dense, because the social/legal/etc structure would not be there to protect them. These are things we've seen to a limited degree in areas with violent rioting.

Re: Women are nearly half of new gun buyers, study finds

#928

Post by throw0101a »

beerandt wrote: post #653
throw0101a wrote: post #485

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And the idea that physically weaker people (often women) can defend themselves against the strong. > Does this idea work? Surprisingly well. Does it? > 11. Self-defense gun use is rare and not more effective at preventing injury than other protective actions > Victims use guns in less than 1% of contact crimes, and women never use guns to protect themselves against sexual assault (in more than 300 cases). Victims u…

This is like claiming people get in car accidents during every single driving trip, because accident reports fail to ever mention drivers reaching their destination safely and without incident.

Of the crimes where the victim was present, using a gun or another "weapon" led to roughly the same outcome:

> Of over 14,000 incidents in which the victim was present, 127 (0.9%) involved a SDGU. SDGU was more common among males, in rural areas, away from home, against male offenders and against offenders with a gun. After any protective action, 4.2% of victims were injured; after SDGU, 4.1% of victims were injured. In property crimes, 55.9% of victims who took protective action lost property, 38.5 of SDGU victims lost property, and 34.9% of victims who used a weapon other than a gun lost property.

* https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S00917...

There's nothing magical about guns: seems that using a baseball bat is just as effective and poses fewer risks in other regards. Hence the title: "not more effective at preventing injury than other protective actions".

Re: Women are nearly half of new gun buyers, study finds

#929

Post by splintercell »

Arrath wrote: post #435
splintercell wrote: post #390

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please note that automatic weapons are already banned from civilian possession. Regarding psychiatric patients and criminals, this has an exact opposite effect that you want. People are far more scared of seeking psychiatric help when they know that they’re going to lose their rights. This is an open secret in gun community to never mention to a doctor that you have guns, and this is an indirect message to not seek p…

As someone who both owns guns, has a concealed carry permit, and has been in therapy and takes anti-depressants, the pervasive fear about getting red flagged and having your firearms taken away seems like overblown fearmongering. Can someone point me towards some statistics or reports of such occurrences?

I don’t understand what are you trying to challenge here? My claim that people think that, or their belief that this does not happen?

I don’t know how can I prove that people think that. You just need to be in the gun community and talk to people who would never put it in writing. My own gun trainer told us the story of a man going to the doctor for getting his hand hurt while doing repairs at home, the doctor chatted with him and he mentioned that he lost his job recently that’s why he had all this free time to do his work, the doctor reported this and his guns were taken away. (Please note no more details were provided than the story).

The point is that mental health is a very tricky game, there is an immediate loss of trust due to the fundamental nature of what it is. I personally don’t think you should own guns if you’re taking antidepressants.

Re: Women are nearly half of new gun buyers, study finds

#930

Post by splintercell »

AQuantized wrote: post #436
KorematsuFredt wrote: post #239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

PS: I am strong supporter of Gun rights and proud gun owner. I fully agree with anti-gun crowd that having vast majority of guns in hands of citizens (legally or illegally) leads to more deaths. USA's comparison with Angola is actually more serious than the numbers tell you because you need to realize that USA has far better medical response and doctors trained to handle gunshot wounds. So to truly compare Angola and…

I think there are many rights violated as a result of lobbying. Access to basic healthcare is curtailed in the name of profit, largely as a result of the power of lobbyists. I think this has a very large functional effect on the freedom of everyday people. Even if they have reasonable means they may be essentially forced to continue working for an employer who provides health insurance or risk personal financial ruin…

Lobbying is simply an open system of advocacy where all the other countries have closed and informal systems.
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