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Apple just kicked Fortnite off the App Store

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Re: Apple just kicked Fortnite off the App Store

#921

Post by saagarjha »

tommymachine wrote: post #775
mapgrep wrote: post #198

You could argue about Apple's rights, or citizens' free speech rights, or consumer rights, under existing law. It would be an interesting discussion because I think it's a lot more complicated an issue that most people appreciate. But really why not talk about how we think things should work on platforms like iOS? What should the law be? What protects essential human rights, encourages creativity, and allows business…

Customers do have the right to install whatever they want. Apple just doesn’t have to facilitate making it super easy for them to do that if they don’t think it contributes to the health of the platform & their business model.

Super easy? There is no way to install an app in your iPhone to export you iMessages or render websites using Gecko short of exploiting it.

Re: Apple just kicked Fortnite off the App Store

#922

Post by jalfresi »

mapcars wrote: post #878
hijklmno wrote: post #696

It's not Apple vs. Fortnite. It's actually Apple vs. Users. Apple has been taking us for a ride this whole time. We pay damn much and buy the phone. It is the user's property from then on. What the user install's and uninstall's from his phone should be his decision. Taking a cut of say, 3%, to keep the app store running is forgivable. But 30% digging into users pocket is unpardonable. Apple is no longer the underdog…

Apple is against freedom like since the beginning, I don't understand how anybody can use any of their products.

Maybe because historically the developer industry has shown that some bad actors can ruin it for everyone? That maybe the App store review process is to benefit ME, as an Apple customer? I WANT a curated App store, simply because I? CANT trust any random app downloaded onto my phone. I pay Apple for that service.

Apple App Store customers are NOT blind sheeple afraid of freedom; I am NOT interested in having a phone that can run any and all software! The industry has proven it cant be trusted, so I pay Apple to gatekeep that for me.

If you still dont get that, I dont know what to tell you...

Re: Apple just kicked Fortnite off the App Store

#923

Post by saagarjha »

ernst_klim wrote: post #789
Sargos wrote: post #490

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have to assume you're not trolling but those are some impressive mental gymnastics my friend. If Apple allowed sideloading then you're experience would be 100% identical. You would have the freedom to continue using the App Store just like you do today and have a nice curated experience. Contracts would continue to work just like they do today. The thing is, the rest of us would have -more- freedom as we could, opt…

>if Apple allowed sideloading then you're experience would be 100% identical 1) Apple allows sideloading, you still can use Cydia, they just don't help you with that. 2) No, because read my post carefully: > As for apple, yes it asks for 30% fee, and it builds a walled garden. But they also offer what others don't: 8 years of support. I'm totally agree to have a walled garden (convenient enough for me), if I could us…

Not only does Apple not help you with installing Cydia, they actively prevent you from doing so using technological measures they do not intend for you to bypass.

Re: Apple just kicked Fortnite off the App Store

#924

Post by saagarjha »

rimliu wrote: post #684
Sargos wrote: post #490

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have to assume you're not trolling but those are some impressive mental gymnastics my friend. If Apple allowed sideloading then you're experience would be 100% identical. You would have the freedom to continue using the App Store just like you do today and have a nice curated experience. Contracts would continue to work just like they do today. The thing is, the rest of us would have -more- freedom as we could, opt…

As if "allow sideloading" is just some boolean flag in the iOS source. Enabling it would have seriuos implications for iOS and for Apple (no matter where from a user download some shady app Apple suddenly becomes responsible).

It’s a fuse in the hardware of the device, literally nothing else. You can grab these devices off the black market today if you are so inclined and don’t really bother much for the law.

Re: Apple just kicked Fortnite off the App Store

#925

Post by alkonaut »

Razengan wrote: post #915
alkonaut wrote: post #906

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> they do a lot to curtail scummy developer practices. Which is excellent. Apple taking a cut for apps I have no problem with. They have support, I trust them with privacy/security and so on. That costs money. The interesting discussion is how much apple can claim to own a part of profits made in the apps, by selling content (in-app purchases). On one hand: if a game is free for a trial, and you can unlock the full g…

> if I buy a recipe app for $10 and then recipes for $1 a piece which I could also buy on the corresponding website, then I don't think apple should have a cut at all. Ah that sounds like a fair point at first, but it could be argued that you gained access to those sales because of Apple. More importantly, they're processing payments for you, and every payment processor out there takes a cut, one way or the other.

I meant the case in the topic where they are not processing the payments.

I did get access to a market/users via the store but I still don’t think that makes Apple eligible for a cut of sales in all apps that they don’t process.

Re: Apple just kicked Fortnite off the App Store

#926

Post by saagarjha »

cblconfederate wrote: post #396
mapgrep wrote: post #198

You could argue about Apple's rights, or citizens' free speech rights, or consumer rights, under existing law. It would be an interesting discussion because I think it's a lot more complicated an issue that most people appreciate. But really why not talk about how we think things should work on platforms like iOS? What should the law be? What protects essential human rights, encourages creativity, and allows business…

Apple could try any amount of tech to lock their devices, but it shouldn't be illegal to break those locks.

It is not illegal to break those locks, at least in the United States. The question is if Apple should provide you with the key if you ask.

Re: Apple just kicked Fortnite off the App Store

#927

Post by saagarjha »

algorithmsRcool wrote: post #531
dmix wrote: post #495

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My favourite is trying to spin two billion dollar companies fighting over percentages as some “big brother” battle. I don’t remember this part of 1984.

Epic might not be the little guy, but Apple is worth almost $2 Trillion. That is a pretty big brother.

Epic is not a little guy but they certainly are the little guy in this fight.

Re: Apple just kicked Fortnite off the App Store

#928

Post by willtim »

jalfresi wrote: post #913
hijklmno wrote: post #696

It's not Apple vs. Fortnite. It's actually Apple vs. Users. Apple has been taking us for a ride this whole time. We pay damn much and buy the phone. It is the user's property from then on. What the user install's and uninstall's from his phone should be his decision. Taking a cut of say, 3%, to keep the app store running is forgivable. But 30% digging into users pocket is unpardonable. Apple is no longer the underdog…

What nonsense. As an Apple customer, the App store is the number one reason I use them - I dont want malware or scummy developers on my phone and I am happy with Apple charging a fee to developers in this manner. It's not like anyone going to switch phones because your app is not on there. Your app is just one of many other apps I use on my phone. Developers are very much looking at this the wrong way - the 30% fee i…

Many people buy Apple hardware because that's where most of the apps are, especially the iPad. I purchased an iPad for my kids for precisely this reason, and regarding the actual software that Apple provides, I am not at all impressed (e.g. app store is a mess, app approvals for kids is very broken). I am also aware that this extortionate 30% transaction cost is likely being passed on to me.

If I could get all the games and educational apps we use on the iPad on another platform, I would ditch Apple in a heartbeat.

Re: Apple just kicked Fortnite off the App Store

#929

Post by anupamchugh »

Despite, Apple's App Store monopoly, I believe in this case, its Epic Games fault. They knew the consquences and still went ahead with it. Make no mistake, its a marketing stunt and would put Apple in the spotlight but in the end the 30% tax won't change for indie developers. Even if Fornite manages to go past it like HEY, Netflix and Spotify.

Re: Apple just kicked Fortnite off the App Store

#930

Post by simonklitj »

fastball wrote: post #900
donkeyd wrote: post #898

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This looks like a great analogy, but it isn't. The app is still running on an Apple platform, with updates going through Apple infrastructure. It's a completely different situation. Don't get me wrong, this statement isn't in support of Apple, I'm just saying that your analogy is bad.

The analogy holds. If I need a replacement part for my Nespresso (app updates) and I order that on Amazon, then Amazon gets their cut for facilitating and fulfilling the delivery of this replacement part. That's reasonable, because you are taking some portion of proceeds from a transaction that you have a hand in . What is not reasonable is for Apple to take a cut from transactions that do not need to involve them. I…

I fail to see how this is a problem, honestly. A part of choosing to distribute to the iPhone platform is making sure all transactions related to the product you distribute go through Apple.

I don't see anybody complaining about Sony taking cuts and requiring transactions go through the PlayStation Network, even though purchasing things for Fortnite there does not in any way, shape or form need to involve the PlayStation Network to be properly facilitated.

Is there something I'm not seeing?

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