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Ross Ulbricht granted a full pardon

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Re: Ross Ulbricht granted a full pardon

#911

Post by karlzt »

_yb2s wrote: post #798

I feel torn about this because it seems there was good evidence for attempted murder- and I cannot understand why they never tried him for that (seemingly larger) crime. However, for the crime he was actually found guilty of, the sentence was unfair and unreasonable. It seems they unethically sentenced him for crimes he was not even ever charged with. I'd also argue he almost certainly saved a huge number of lives wi…

As for the murder part Christina Warren knows best:

The murder for hire bit was always the most bullshit of all the charges. Not only were the fbi agents that were part of that later jailed for their own actions related to the case (including theft and hiding/deleting evidence), it was never real and no one was ever in danger.

https://bsky.app/profile/filmgirl.bsky.social/post/3lgcck6i6...

Re: Ross Ulbricht granted a full pardon

#912

Post by jjallen »

aerostable_slug wrote: post #908
jjallen wrote: post #898

So if you start a website and facilitate thousands of drug deals and get lots of people to ask the president to pardon you, and you’re white, you can get a pardon. But for everyone else you can’t. Even if you’re in prison for possession of drugs for more than ten years. Also if you try to overthrow the government you get pardoned which I would have guessed approaches treason. These are pardonable offenses and conditi…

There's no reason to bring race into this. Trump has pardoned PoC convicted of drug offenses, e.g. Weldon Angelos. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weldon_Angelos_case

He’s white and that can’t be left out of it. Let’s not pretend race doesn’t matter in any of these things. It is a fact that he’s white and I’m guessing ALL of the Jan 6th people are too.

Re: Ross Ulbricht granted a full pardon

#913

Post by [deleted] »

bmelton wrote: post #910
jjallen wrote: post #898

So if you start a website and facilitate thousands of drug deals and get lots of people to ask the president to pardon you, and you’re white, you can get a pardon. But for everyone else you can’t. Even if you’re in prison for possession of drugs for more than ten years. Also if you try to overthrow the government you get pardoned which I would have guessed approaches treason. These are pardonable offenses and conditi…

I felt the same when Biden pardoned the judge who put kids in jail for pay, or the nursing home CEO who took money away from the elderly to buy yachts, but I'd decided that pardons were effectively for sale (tho likely by barter) -- seeing Biden close out his term and Trump open his term with pardons has been kind to those who'd like to compare and contrast, but they both mostly just appear to be paying down debts.

[deleted]

Re: Ross Ulbricht granted a full pardon

#914

Post by ErrantX »

_yb2s wrote: post #807
azinman2 wrote: post #800

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not going to comment on the murder part as that’s well discussed here. I would take issue with assuming that it was net positive with ratings. Given the anonymous nature handling bots spamming fake reviews would be even harder to catch here, and you ultimately don’t know who ended up addicted/hooked/DUI’s etc from the easy availability this provided. I’m not sure the total effects could ever be qualified, but it’s no…

> I would take issue with assuming that it was net positive with ratings. I know this is probably as minority view, but I think if adults consent to buying and using any drug, that should be both fully legal, and their right and responsibility- any negative consequences are 100% their own fault, not the person who sold them. It's probably true that making drugs easier to buy made more people buy them, but I was only…

> Trump is not an idealist- he will promise anything to anyone if it gets power and attention. Previously, he had attempted a political career as a leftist, and switched to the right because it was getting more traction.

This is a critical point. His explicitly goal is to be an autocrat, there is no other ideology other than what works.

That's why I think the only real bit of him is the one that admires Putin. That is who he wants to be.

It's why his moves seem so random.

Re: Ross Ulbricht granted a full pardon

#915

Post by billiam »

_yb2s wrote: post #798

I feel torn about this because it seems there was good evidence for attempted murder- and I cannot understand why they never tried him for that (seemingly larger) crime. However, for the crime he was actually found guilty of, the sentence was unfair and unreasonable. It seems they unethically sentenced him for crimes he was not even ever charged with. I'd also argue he almost certainly saved a huge number of lives wi…

I just can't fathom the lack of self-awareness of people who championed Ross Ulbricht's cause, seemingly because he looks like them, codes like them, and sat in the same public library they frequent or became associated with a techno-libertarian identity. Hundreds of drug and gun dealers are sentenced every week, some certainly unjustly. Where is the outrage for them?

Re: Ross Ulbricht granted a full pardon

#916

Post by BurningFrog »

tdb7893 wrote: post #194
BurningFrog wrote: post #92

Keep in mind that he spent 11 years locked up. He's not getting off lightly!

I'm just shocked it was a full pardon instead of a commutation or something. I don't think the US is gaining a ton from keeping him locked up but he still did run an organization he knew was used for selling drugs and other illegal things and a full pardon for that seems weird. I feel like I mainly heard people talking about commuting his sentence

I agree that a commutation would have made much more sense.

But "always make sense" doesn't seem to be in Trumps OKRs...

That's mostly a symbolic difference though. The practical end result is the same

Re: Ross Ulbricht granted a full pardon

#917

Post by MarkPNeyer »

diggan wrote: post #852
azinman2 wrote: post #800

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not going to comment on the murder part as that’s well discussed here. I would take issue with assuming that it was net positive with ratings. Given the anonymous nature handling bots spamming fake reviews would be even harder to catch here, and you ultimately don’t know who ended up addicted/hooked/DUI’s etc from the easy availability this provided. I’m not sure the total effects could ever be qualified, but it’s no…

> That’s also not to mention guns and all kinds of other dangerous & illegal parts of it. I think it isn't mentioned because Silk Road didn't actually facilitate any selling/buying of weapons or any items "whose purpose was to "harm or defraud."" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silk_Road_(marketplace)#Produc... > I do not understand why he pardoned this guy when he’s supposedly anti-drug and anti-cartel. He's the candi…

There are many Christians who would happily to get in long arguments over which values are “clearly Christian.”

If you really want to understand, it’s not hard. It just requires making an honest effort to try, without judging. And that’s what stops people who don’t understand it. Try chatting with an LLM sometime about what it looks like from their perspective. Knowing it’s not a human makes it easier to avoid getting upset.

Re: Ross Ulbricht granted a full pardon

#918

Post by verteu »

karlzt wrote: post #911
_yb2s wrote: post #798

I feel torn about this because it seems there was good evidence for attempted murder- and I cannot understand why they never tried him for that (seemingly larger) crime. However, for the crime he was actually found guilty of, the sentence was unfair and unreasonable. It seems they unethically sentenced him for crimes he was not even ever charged with. I'd also argue he almost certainly saved a huge number of lives wi…

As for the murder part Christina Warren knows best: The murder for hire bit was always the most bullshit of all the charges. Not only were the fbi agents that were part of that later jailed for their own actions related to the case (including theft and hiding/deleting evidence), it was never real and no one was ever in danger. https://bsky.app/profile/filmgirl.bsky.social/post/3lgcck6i6...

> it was never real and no one was ever in danger.

Because one of the hitmen he hired was a scammer, and another was an FBI agent. Still clearly a crime to hire them for murder.

Ulbricht's right-hand-man Roger Thomas Clark, who was involved in one of the murder-for-hire conversations, admitted the conversation was real during his trial:

"In his own remarks, Clark didn't comment on that murder-for-hire conversation—which he at one point claimed had been fabricated by Ulbricht but later conceded was real."

Re: Ross Ulbricht granted a full pardon

#919

Post by doctorpangloss »

billiam wrote: post #915
_yb2s wrote: post #798

I feel torn about this because it seems there was good evidence for attempted murder- and I cannot understand why they never tried him for that (seemingly larger) crime. However, for the crime he was actually found guilty of, the sentence was unfair and unreasonable. It seems they unethically sentenced him for crimes he was not even ever charged with. I'd also argue he almost certainly saved a huge number of lives wi…

I just can't fathom the lack of self-awareness of people who championed Ross Ulbricht's cause, seemingly because he looks like them, codes like them, and sat in the same public library they frequent or became associated with a techno-libertarian identity. Hundreds of drug and gun dealers are sentenced every week, some certainly unjustly. Where is the outrage for them?

Ha ha, it turns out that there is affirmative action, for libertarians!

Re: Ross Ulbricht granted a full pardon

#920

Post by mannerheim »

snakeyjake wrote: post #893

Libertarians are the cheapest fucking buys of all time. They will sell their souls to a man who would grind them into a paste and sell that paste as a protein snack to his cultists-- in exchange for a hollow, symbolic win that either impacts them in no way whatsoever or maliciously hurts people they don't like. At least with other political groups you have to, you know, BRIBE them. Libertarians are so used to receivi…

That hollow, symbolic win could have been given to them by anyone other than Trump. If nobody else thinks a group's interests are worth listening to, don't be surprised when they start chasing after the tiniest morsels.
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