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M4 MacBook Pro

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Re: M4 MacBook Pro

#911

Post by zamadatix »

bluSCALE4 wrote: post #661
the_king wrote: post #652

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly my point. Saying something is the fastest ever is marketing code (at least to me) for minor improvement over the previous generation. If you're 30% faster than the previous generation, I'd rather see that because my assumption is it's 5%.

Yeah, better than the glaring, 10x better than i7 Intel Mac. Like that's even a valid point of reference.

I think the point is to try to convince MacBook users who haven't looked to upgrade yet rather than something trying to make a comparison to other non-mac models you could buy today. From that perspective it's perfectly valid, even if it doesn't tick the boxes of what others might want from a different comparison perspective.

Re: M4 MacBook Pro

#912

Post by eilefsen »

nkmskdmfodf wrote: post #758
lukev wrote: post #535

I really respect Apple's privacy focused engineering. They didn't roll out _any_ AI features until they were capable of running them locally, and before doing any cloud-based AI they designed and rolled out Private Cloud Compute. You can argue about whether it's actually bulletproof or not but the fact is, nobody else is even trying, and have lost sight of all privacy-focused features in their rush to ship anything a…

> I am thrilled to shell out thousands and thousands of dollars to purchase a machine that feels like it really belongs to me, from a company that respects my data and has aligned incentives. You either have have very low standards or very low understanding if you think a completely closed OS on top of completely closed hardware somehow means it 'really belongs' to you, or that your data/privacy is actually being res…

"completely closed OS" is not accurate. apple releases a surprising amount of source code.

https://opensource.apple.com/releases/

Re: M4 MacBook Pro

#913

Post by resource_waste »

giobox wrote: post #641
the_king wrote: post #593

The single core performance looks really fast. Chip | Geekbench Score (Process) ---- | ------------------------ M1 | 2,419 (5nm) M2 | 2,658 (5nm) M3 | 3,076 (3nm) M4* | 3,810 (3nm) In my experience, single-core CPU is the best all-around indicator of how "fast" a machine feels. I feel like Apple kind of buried this in their press release. M4 benchmark source: https://browser.geekbench.com/v6/cpu/8171874

> I feel like Apple kind of buried this in their press release The press release describes the single core performance as the fastest ever made, full stop: "The M4 family features phenomenal single-threaded CPU performance with the world’s fastest CPU core" The same statement is made repeatedly across most the new M4 line up marketing materials. I think thats enough to get the point across that its a pretty quick mac…

lol

After decades of Apple, people still believe them.

Re: M4 MacBook Pro

#914

Post by zamadatix »

KeplerBoy wrote: post #853
the_king wrote: post #593

The single core performance looks really fast. Chip | Geekbench Score (Process) ---- | ------------------------ M1 | 2,419 (5nm) M2 | 2,658 (5nm) M3 | 3,076 (3nm) M4* | 3,810 (3nm) In my experience, single-core CPU is the best all-around indicator of how "fast" a machine feels. I feel like Apple kind of buried this in their press release. M4 benchmark source: https://browser.geekbench.com/v6/cpu/8171874

I wonder how reliable geekbench tests are. Afaik it's the most common benchmark run on apple devices, so apple has a great interest in making sure their newest chips perform great on the test. I wouldn't be surprised to hear that the geekbench developers are heavily supported by apple's own performance engineers and that testing might not be as objective or indicative of real world perf as one would hope.

Wouldn't it be more surprising to you Apple has been selling 4 generations of the M series to great acclaim on the performance but it all turned out to be a smoke and mirrors show because the hardware is optimized for one particular benchmark they didn't even reference in their comparisons?

From the data side: the M4 hasn't made it to the charts yet but the M3 already holds the 4th place in PassMark's single thread chart as well https://www.cpubenchmark.net/singleThread.html as well as tops Cinebench 2024 https://www.cpu-monkey.com/en/cpu_benchmark-cinebench_2024_s...

The only areas the M series "lags" is in the high end workstation/server segment where they don't really have a 96+ core option or in spaces where you pop in beefy high end GPUs. Everything else the M4 tends to lead in right now.

Re: M4 MacBook Pro

#915

Post by trogdor »

orf wrote: post #598
lukev wrote: post #554

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course I wish the hardware were somehow more open, but to a large extent, it's directly because of hardware based privacy features. If you allowed third-party components without restraint, there'd be no way to prevent someone swapping out a component. Lock-in and planned obsolescence are also factors, and ones I'm glad the EU (and others) are pushing back here. But it isn't as if there are no legitimate tradeoffs.…

One of the most underrated macOS features is the screen sharing app - it’s great for seamless tech support with parents. It works via your keychain and your contacts, and the recipient gets a little notification to allow you to view their screen. That’s it - no downloads, no login, no 20 minutes getting a Remote Desktop screen share set up.

You’re talking about through FaceTime, right? Or is there another native screen sharing app that I am unaware of?

Re: M4 MacBook Pro

#916

Post by bluedino »

heavyset_go wrote: post #740
syndicatedjelly wrote: post #572

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> MacOS also tightens the screws on what you can run and from where, or at least require more hoop jumping over time. Can you explain what you mean by this? I have been doing software development on MacOS for the last couple of years and have found it incredibly easy to run anything I want on my computer from the terminal, whenever I want. Maybe I'm not the average user, but I use mostly open-source Unix tooling and…

> Can you explain what you mean by this? I have been doing software development on MacOS for the last couple of years and have found it incredibly easy to run anything I want on my computer from the terminal, whenever I want. Try sharing a binary that you built but didn't sign and Notarize and you'll see the problem. It'll run on the machine that it was built on without a problem, the problems start when you move the…

My (very large US company) workplace has their own, branded app store for Mac users. One of our most popular apps is 'Gatekeeper disable'

Re: M4 MacBook Pro

#917

Post by alexlll862 »

bilbo0s wrote: post #869
siajdsioajd wrote: post #763

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They just have really good marketing. You fell for their pandering. If you really care about privacy use Linux. But Apple ain't it. Closed source and proprietary will never be safe from corporate greed. > https://archive.ph/Z9z0H

Linux doesn't give you privacy guy. If you're using the web, your privacy is about your browser and your ISP, not your OS. At times, it's even about how you use your browser. No browser will save you from telling google too much about yourself by using gmail, and viewing youtube videos, and using search. The AI's and algorithms collating all that information on the backend see right through "incognito" mode. Telling…

You missed the point completely. The problem with a user hostile closed OS like Windows is that they collect a lot of data from your computer even if you never open a web browser. You have no clue what they collect and what they do with the data

Re: M4 MacBook Pro

#918

Post by KeplerBoy »

zamadatix wrote: post #914
KeplerBoy wrote: post #853

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder how reliable geekbench tests are. Afaik it's the most common benchmark run on apple devices, so apple has a great interest in making sure their newest chips perform great on the test. I wouldn't be surprised to hear that the geekbench developers are heavily supported by apple's own performance engineers and that testing might not be as objective or indicative of real world perf as one would hope.

Wouldn't it be more surprising to you Apple has been selling 4 generations of the M series to great acclaim on the performance but it all turned out to be a smoke and mirrors show because the hardware is optimized for one particular benchmark they didn't even reference in their comparisons? From the data side: the M4 hasn't made it to the charts yet but the M3 already holds the 4th place in PassMark's single thread c…

Okay, the linked benchmarks proved me wrong. I trust cinebench numbers a whole lot more than a geekbench score.

My bad.

And just to be clear: I didn't speculate that Apple tune's its chip to Geekbench, I speculated that geekbench was overly optimized towards apple's latest chip.

Re: M4 MacBook Pro

#920

Post by flkiwi »

saagarjha wrote: post #809
flkiwi wrote: post #472

The weird thing about these Apple product videos in the last few years is that there are all these beautiful shots of Apple's campus with nobody there other than the presenter. It's a beautiful stage for these videos, but it's eerie and disconcerting, particularly given Apple's RTO approach.

The Mac mini video from yesterday has employees: https://www.apple.com/105/media/us/mac-mini/2024/58e5921e-f4...

That by itself raises an interesting editorial question. Apple (like most big companies) doesn't do things randomly re: high impact public communications like this. I'm curious what made the Mac mini a product that merited showing people doing things, with a computer that is tied to one location, vs. a Macbook Pro's comparative emptiness, for a computer that can go anywhere and be with anyone. It could be as simple as fun vs focus.
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