Long term I think we're good, eventually somehow things will settle. Short term it's going to be horrible no matter what outcome in the November elections, the country appears divided beyond repair. Two steps forward one backwards as the saying goes but it appears we're now taking more like ten backwards.
Ruth Bader Ginsburg has died
911–920 of 1001 posts
Re: Ruth Bader Ginsburg has died
#912Earlier quoted context omitted.
McConnell says you never replace a Supreme Court Justice in an election year. Let's see just how long it takes him to release a public statement going back on that one...
> Mr. McConnell and his allies say the two situations are different. Where one party controls the Senate and the other the presidency, as in 2016, they say, vacancies should not be filled in a presidential election year. Where the same party controls both the Senate and presidency, they argue, confirmations may proceed. https://www.nytimes.com/2020/09/18/us/justice-ruth-bader-gin...
It's a terrible argument. If the senate is not controlled by the same party as the president and they dislike the president's choice for supreme court, they can vote not to confirm him/her. It also encourages the president to choose a nominee who can appeal to both parties. McConnell refused to allow Garland to even have hearings in the Senate let alone a vote because he feared that some of his republican colleagues may have been persuaded. If there are two controlling parties in two parts of the government then the solution is compromise. This is a philosophy totally abhorrent to McConnell whose views can only be supported by an authoritarian minority.
Re: Ruth Bader Ginsburg has died
#913Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think this might collapse at the edge cases: If I'm a black man and the opinion is that I'm an animal, and the person with the opinion uses this reasoning to abuse me, then I may be ethically correct to not listen or keep myself in their presence. Or, say, I'm a disabled person and someone tells me they think social services should be cut so people like me can die off for the good of humanity. It may be actively em…
It's easy to come up with these kinds of excuses for not tolerating the opinions of people you disagree with. If you disagree with me about abortion, you are either trying to murder babies (and hence I shouldn't have to be civil to you) or you're trying to control women's bodies (and hence I shouldn't have to be civil with you). If you disagree with me about health care reform, that's a life and death issue and hence…
There's a factor not considered here: to what extent were Scalia & Ginsberg able to get along because of other material conditions?
As supreme court justices we can assume that they had a basic foundation of psychological and material security - a position of prestige, a job for life, healthcare and so on.
I believe it is a lot easier to summon the "higher thoughts" necessary to be civil when ones personal position is more secure, so to achieve a more civil society it may help to work to make more insecure people secure.
Re: Ruth Bader Ginsburg has died
#914RBG was also the voice of reason when Justice Kavanaugh was under attack by an unhinged mob. She truly could see beyond politics, and will be missed by both sides of the aisle.
I still don't understand how, putting aside the rape allegations, kavanaugh's outbursts about Clinton conspiracy theories, "I like beer", and flat out lies about things like "Devil's triangle" being a drinking game didn't disqualify him.
You can say that the rape wasn't proven beyond a reasonable doubt. Or that the outbursts were him having a bad day (it's not like SCOTUS is a very exclusive position /s).
But that lie about devil's triangle being a game of quarters is so blatant. It's an incredibly common term that I am sure the average person has heard and can say that was an obvious lie.
Re: Ruth Bader Ginsburg has died
#915RBG was also the voice of reason when Justice Kavanaugh was under attack by an unhinged mob. She truly could see beyond politics, and will be missed by both sides of the aisle.
The voice? I think there were many voices of reason that had his back. It was very enlightening to see what extremes people will go to at times.
There wasn't any credible evidence that he had attended any such party, let alone done the things Blasey Ford claimed he did. Or even that Blasey Ford knew him then. That's why it fell apart. So, yes, "unhinged mob" is a completely appropriate description of the clown car attempt to disqualify him.
If Amy Coney Barrett is the nominee, expect random men to come out of the woodwork claiming that she raped them in college. Recall how hard the left had to reach to dredge up dirt in the Kavanaugh circus but now having to do it against a woman with even less actual material to work with. Still, I wouldn't put it past the wokies to attempt it. Nothing from these people surprises me anymore.
Re: Ruth Bader Ginsburg has died
#916I think reading about Ruth and Antonin Scalia's friendship was the most wholesome political reading I've ever done. Hearing people divided in opinion, but not bitterly so, working together to figure out the best framework to construct American society from was inspirational. I hope the two halves of the political world can become friends in the way they were. Rest in peace Ruth. I hope if there's an after you and Ant…
Was so lovely after reading the article, that the point that stuck with me, aligned with your comment right at the top. Maybe there's some sort of new "non-denominational creed" we could all sign up for. ~" We may not agree but I will always listen to you. I will always consider your opinion with respect and will endeavour to understand your reasoning. My views are not set - my goal is to listen to arguments to come…
I think my problem with statements like this, is that while I can totally imagine the liberals I know taking this viewpoint, there are very few conservatives I know that do. The response will be something like:
“Why would I listen to these whiners? I already know what I want.”
Re: Ruth Bader Ginsburg has died
#917Earlier quoted context omitted.
Was so lovely after reading the article, that the point that stuck with me, aligned with your comment right at the top. Maybe there's some sort of new "non-denominational creed" we could all sign up for. ~" We may not agree but I will always listen to you. I will always consider your opinion with respect and will endeavour to understand your reasoning. My views are not set - my goal is to listen to arguments to come…
I think my problem with statements like this, is that while I can totally imagine the liberals I know taking this viewpoint, there are very few conservatives I know that do. The response will be something like: “Why would I listen to these whiners? I already know what I want.”
Yeah, the reality is that "listening and respecting the opinions of people whom you disagree with" (or not) is an ideology in its own right.
One would hope that it'd be orthogonal to conservatism/liberalism or any other political spectrum, but I suspect it's not.
Re: Ruth Bader Ginsburg has died
#918These justices should be appointed by 2/3 majority in both chambers. That way we’d be talking about RBG now rather than the replacement.
Re: Ruth Bader Ginsburg has died
#919Earlier quoted context omitted.
McConnell immediately clarified his position was "the Senate shouldn't consider a nomination in an election year if it's controlled by my party and the president isn't in my party" -- no kidding, this was his actual clarification.
I don't know that in the current political climate, the democrats would extend the same courtesy if it happened under their control of the Senate and White House.
Lately I see a lot of people saying things like “this particular example of real behavior is bad and conflicts with my values so should be electorally punished, but my mental model of the other side tells me that they would probably do the same thing if they hypothetically got the opportunity, and so I’m not going to uphold my values.”
Re: Ruth Bader Ginsburg has died
#920Damn.
Time to watch “The Supremes” episode of West Wing and cry.