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The PyCon Incident

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Re: The PyCon Incident

#901

Post by doktrin »

blhack wrote: post #7

I would also like a response from Sendgrid here. Somebody they sent to a conference, who was representing their company there, went on a personal vendetta against somebody and got them fired. That's awful, and I join the people I see online right now in saying that I cannot, in good conscience, ever do business with a company that supports that behavior. --And to how far Adria has set back womens' rights here-- The c…

>It's really sad.

I agree. This is an embarrassment through and through. What started as a grotesque overreaction has spiralled into a venomous shitstorm. Truly infuriating.

Re: The PyCon Incident

#902

Post by white_devil »

jamesaguilar wrote: post #79
white_devil wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What's professional is defined by the context. What's professional is just meaningless uptightery. What actually matters is getting shit done, and treating others well.

Treating others well is typically thought of as a component of professionalism. How you "get shit done" is another component of it.

The way you speak and the way you dress are also considered part of "professionalism". Those are the parts that I take issue with.

Re: The PyCon Incident

#903

Post by vacri »

mcherm wrote: post #868
katbyte wrote: post #812

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the majority of criticism is that she escalated things so rapidly to publicly shaming people who didn't deserve it costing a man his job over a silly dick joke that that majority of women wouldn't have batted an eye over. If she didn't publicly identify him, no one would have cared. If she had simply notified the conference staff, no one would have cared. She took it to extremes, and now the internet is respo…

Adria did NOT fire this man. As far as I can tell, she never ran a campaign to get him fired. What she did was to report what occurred, including the names of those involved. If your local newspaper ran an article exposing a scandal, and the participants in the scandal got in trouble because it came to light, would you blame the newspaper? If this was a minor offense that no one should have cared about, then reportin…

You yourself posted the Code of Conduct, in which it states not only that harassment is 'not appropriate' (same as sexual language), but also that "We do not tolerate harassment of conference participants in any form" - and naming and shaming on twitter is a form of harassment.

Re: The PyCon Incident

#904

Post by rmrfrmrf »

belorn wrote: post #842
ErrantX wrote: post #444

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Really, firing the individual makes sense to me. Pycon does have a code of conduct, which includes avoiding sexualised language. I'm not into the whole big brother idea, but there is such a thing as "time and place" :) and the wrong time and place to make sexualised jokes, is when you are sat in public at a conference with a policy against such things... Reputationally, the company has a right to be both disappointed…

Fire the individual has as about as much sense, as kicking someone out of an airport because they happen to have a bottle with more than 3.4 ounce of liquid. Sure, there might be a rule or code, but there is also a thing called overreaction.

I bet he won't make the same mistake again. Perhaps we're all so used to going through the 6 month HR-slap-on-the-wrist process that we have lost touch of what it actually takes to change a person's behavior.

Re: The PyCon Incident

#905

Post by jasonlotito »

camelite wrote: post #744
jasonlotito wrote: post #415

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Had they not been able to verify the claims then it would have been too late. This is besides the point, as the claims were verified. But, I believe you are wrong. I think if she was found to be lying, the backlash would have been on here. Heck, her claims were verified, and their is still a much strong backlash from the community toward her and SendGrid. I agree. Crying wolf is should not be encouraged. But many t…

No, she's being to to speak up AND handle it behind the scenes. At what point in this conversation did you forget the fact that an identifiable picture was posted publicly to her 9000 followers?

> At what point in this conversation did you forget the fact that an identifiable picture was posted publicly to her 9000 followers?

Never, and so what? This happens all the time at public events. Hell, the HN is generally in strong support of laws that uphold such a thing. Apparently, just when it happens to other people.

> No, she's being to to speak up AND handle it behind the scenes.

Going to address this here. Unfortunately, this isn't as easy as it sounds. It's easy to say report it, but when put into that situation, it's not always as easy to speak up. This is a very well known phenomenon. That she didn't follow the reporting procedure to a T is forgivable, just as what the guy did was forgivable.

Re: The PyCon Incident

#906

Post by pekk »

crooy wrote: post #871
katbyte wrote: post #799

Earlier quoted context omitted.

mine to, i also get the impression she is one to overreact and then justify her actions later.

Come on, she's a women... it is in her nature to overreact :-)

This remark is unacceptable and harmful

Re: The PyCon Incident

#907

Post by hythloday »

vilda wrote: post #486
hythloday wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"The results of two experiments supported the hypothesis that, for sexist men, exposure to sexist humour can promote the behavioural release of prejudice against women." http://psp.sagepub.com/content/34/2/159.abstract Women are tangibly harmed by sexist jokes.

"for sexist men, exposure to sexist humor can promote the behavioral release of prejudice against women" Am I reading it right that this makes the study irrelevant? Isn't it like "for violent men, playing violent games makes them violent"?

It's more like "for violent men, watching violent video games makes them more violent".

Re: The PyCon Incident

#908

Post by vacri »

ensignavenger wrote: post #705
shardling wrote: post #456

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did she? I just read the entire post, and I disagree. http://butyoureagirl.com/14015/forking-and-dongle-jokes-dont... It certainly exists within the context of gender issues at a tech conference, but she didn't even go so far as to label the jokes sexist -- just something that would make some women uncomfortable. (Which is obviously true, given her response!)

Yes, she did- "this wasn't the first time that day I had to address this issue around harassment and gender." She clearly states in her blog she felt it involved "harassment and gender", which is often referred to as sexism.

She also projects her own fantasy onto a little girl, apropos of nothing, already proclaiming the girls career in tech dead in the water.

She did the right thing by notifying conference staff and letting them handle it. She did the wrong thing by naming and shaming on twitter. The blog post reads like a mix of real event and revisionism to stem angry internetters.

Still, it's a storm in a teacup - who's to say the same guy wasn't on the verge of being let go for other reasons anyway? It's presumptuous to assuming his firing was solely because of this single event.

Re: The PyCon Incident

#909

Post by johnward »

I dont't know the full details only some of the HN and Twitter drama.

Here is how I think this should have played out.

dudes:"lol dude something something penis like joke" chick: "hey do you guys mind not talking like that it's a bit uncomfortable" dude: "oh sorry I didn't realize."(stops making dick jokes).

No need to continue to make jokes. No need to go to twitter. No need for someone to be fired.

That is my opinion of how this could have been handled with mutual respect. Also I think the initial joke was more childish than sexist. It's a conference for industry professionals, not 8th graders.

Re: The PyCon Incident

#910

Post by jaimebuelta »

Romme wrote: post #859

Fuck the patriarchy: http://i.imgur.com/JioQv6f.jpg

That image seems extremely suspicious to me. I've tried to localize the tweet on Adria's twitter and I haven't been able.

Giving that doing some research it seems that she had a dog called Bluey that recently pass away, I found this "image of a tweet" quite difficult to believe.

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