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NASA chief suggests SpaceX may be booted from moon mission

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Re: NASA chief suggests SpaceX may be booted from moon mission

#901

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This is the trolling equivalent of "embrace, extend, extinguish." They are mocking the people who believe it by amplifying it, making Trump 2028 merch, etc.

Haha, only serious?

Yes. Even sent a bunch of Trump 2028 hats to Gavin Newsom.

https://nypost.com/2025/08/28/us-news/trump-supporters-troll...

Re: NASA chief suggests SpaceX may be booted from moon mission

#902

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Re: 1. I think the America of Theseus mindset is a bit troubling. A lot of people like to identify with achievements that they played no role in. Based on zero expertise whatsoever, I have a sense that this is a bit self defeating. To be born a winner, to be taught you’re a winner… how can that be healthy? Today’s America scores zero points for its accomplishments of the past. But I think one way it can be a good thi…

Isn't the point we've been - and we've learned there really isn't much there and it's not worth the effort? Even at the time people suspected that - but at least there was a chance of finding something unexpected. As to the knowledge is has been done, and therefore could be done again - sure that's valuable, but that knowledge belongs to the whole world not just to America. And in terms of national prestige or unitin…

Boots on the moon! Maybe we will want that helium 3 since it looks like fusion has a shot.

Re: NASA chief suggests SpaceX may be booted from moon mission

#903
post #624

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It also ignores the fact that empires can decline. (Although I think the moon landing is ridiculous there is no scientific reason for it).

The space race was not a scientific endeavor either. It was driven by a political need. It was to prove that your economic system could muster the correct machinery to get to the moon. Once we got to the moon, nothing significantly changed scientifically, but politically it was a bombshell. The act of getting the moon now is, once again, not a scientific endeavor. It is once again a holistic test of whether the count…

And the USSR decidedly pwned America at every space medal but one. After America won one medal, we decided that was the one that actually counted, we forgot all that happened previously, because the USSR won them, and we stopped doing any more, lest the USSR win them.

If the point was to prove which economic system is better, the outcome was clear: totalitarian dictatorship with a solid education system far outcompetes capitalism with strong government intervention. In fact it seems that the more there's a guy at the top forcing everyone to work towards an achievable goal, the more likely the goal is to be achieved. There are other reasons to dislike totalitarian dictatorships, of course.

Re: NASA chief suggests SpaceX may be booted from moon mission

#904

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What’s the main motivation for the moon? Is it a better location than the international space station? What’s the reasoning there?

I think its to prepare for mars (sort of), its the closest place where we can build a self-sustaining civilization.

We definitely cannot build a self sustaining civilization on the moon.

Re: NASA chief suggests SpaceX may be booted from moon mission

#905
post #890

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I'm assuming SpaceX will win this, and lamenting that. However I'm also being more general because you are absolutely on the same page as me that this is a decades-old problem. I don't hate the player, I hate the game.

Lamenting it why though? Because it's sad that other space companies are shit? Yea ok. I can get behind it. Because you dislike Elon and would rather see the US space program turn to shit than allow Elon to get a symbolic win? Then I'm not onboard anymore.

No I couldn't care less about the people involved. And while it is sad that other space companies are not at the same level as SpaceX right now, even that wasn't my point. I'm sorry for the confusion.

My issue is purely with the US government's acquisitions process that seems to encourage a lack of competition and actually seems to actively hinder good research and development.

This monopsony needs an alternative.

Re: NASA chief suggests SpaceX may be booted from moon mission

#906

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This is Destin of SmarterEveryDay. This is a very good speech, very courageous and has implications for all of society. American society seems to be more and more controlled by people in positions where they cannot fail. The example that originally put this idea in my head was the Mozilla CEO who, oversaw a year during which Firefox usership fell, and Mozilla workers were fired, and then the CEO received a pay raise.…

> is a very good speech, very courageous Really? It’s eye opening. But Destin seems to miss the point. We’re not trying to go back to the Moon, one and done. That was Apollo. We’re trying to build a system that reduces the repeat cost of Moon access, with medium-term plans for permanent settlement. (Like in Antarctica. Not The Expanse .) His criticism of Artemis is on point. But his anchoring to Apollo is bewildering…

They laugh at his jokes, and then sit deadly silent when asked "we're going, right?"

Does anyone expect were going to launch Artemis rockets over and over for decades? Aren't they extremely expensive?

Re: NASA chief suggests SpaceX may be booted from moon mission

#907

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Your example does not support your argument. Unlike heart surgery, there hasn't been a major shift in what we could do if we went back, and more exploration probably won't change the commercial or military prospects of the moon.

No. Of course, there is a giant shift in what we could do. We can build far more reliable rockets. We have incredible progresses in materials science, in our understanding of the moon's geology. Likewise, we established the presence of water. We have more advanced solar panels, better batteries, we have a lot of recent research on modular, safe nuclear reactors that could probably lead more easily to moon-ready react…

I agree that we have all those things, but what do we do with them? What's the end benefit?

I'm not asking rhetorically, and if the answer is that the knock-off effects of doing this will provide a ton of technology that will help the rest of Earth eat, live and pursue happiness then I think that's a pretty kick-ass answer. But is that where you were going?

Re: NASA chief suggests SpaceX may be booted from moon mission

#908
post #552
post #513

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Sailing vessels serve an actual purpose, though. The Dutch didn't build better boats for bragging rights.

National pride has long been tightly coupled to seafaring capabilities. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vasa_(ship) "Richly decorated as a symbol of the king's ambitions for Sweden and himself, upon completion she was one of the most powerfully armed vessels in the worl"

Sorry, you're right - they didn't build them solely for bragging rights.

Re: NASA chief suggests SpaceX may be booted from moon mission

#909

"The president and I want to get to the moon in this president's term" - Sean Duffy NASA administrator. A scary way to set a schedule on a complex project with lives at stake. They don't care though.

In this administration, government agencies are not expected to have any independence and cannot express doubts about administration goals without risking being fired. In addition, the administration has a taste for extortion and this may simply be a way to raise money from Musk and Bezos for the political and personal enrichment of the President.

Re: NASA chief suggests SpaceX may be booted from moon mission

#910

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SpaceX has already successfully landed and reused a booster, which is the most expensive part of the rocket. As for the reentry problem, that seems to have been solved in the last couple of test flights. Still much more economically viable than SLS even if they can't reuse the upper stage.

As someone who is a tad skeptical of SpaceX duevto their side claims, I have to give it to them, that last launch of Starship proved they are making some real progress again. Wasnt looking good at the start of the year but now their re-entries are doing fairly well.

I agree, they are doing a great job with Starship so far. I think they were overly optimistic at first (Typical Engineering Management Thing), but their Raptor engines alone are a huge advancement. The rest of Starship is coming together great.

They have set a hard goal, but they definitely have the expertise to make it work. I look forward to seeing the first orbital re-fueling.

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