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How to Work Hard

paulgraham.com

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Re: How to Work Hard

#901

Post by rewgs »

Tycho wrote: post #658
Nursie wrote: post #628

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some are, others are not. Some build communities, others do not. Some games are played with friends and family, and some are not. Some fiction has artistic merit, other fiction does not. Your views are about as up to date as “games are for kids”

Sure, some gaming could be a healthy bit of fun in a social context, but it tends not to be, doesn’t it? It tends to become a massive time sink, the accumulation of which over many years, usually of your youth (notice that older people just lose interest in games, like they suddenly don’t see value in them anymore), will not leave you well-read or physically fit or able to entertain others or even good memories - jus…

I get what you're saying, and think you're mostly right.

However, I just booted up Breath of the Wild for the first time in a year (it's the not the first video game I've played in a year -- I just haven't played it in a year) and was absolutely astonished at how beautiful and well-designed it is. "Soul-filling" is a proper adjective for its affect of me.

Some games are obvious dopamine and money pits; some games are art. Those in the latter category are unfortunately few and far between, but I suppose every medium is like that. Some books are just as pointless and trashy as Clash of Clans.

Re: How to Work Hard

#902

Post by silviot »

As others have already pointed out this will go down in history as the "Let them eat cake" of our times. The disconnect with the real life of billions of people is astonishing.

Re: How to Work Hard

#903

Post by pdimitar »

ABCLAW wrote: post #750
pdimitar wrote: post #595

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At 41 y/o I am going mostly through the same. Without my wife I would have become a completely numb robot. But even if you don't have a good partner -- or friends, or your older family -- to turn to, I'd recommend the following: Engage in interviews but be upfront: you're not looking to prove yourself, you are not interested in stocks / futures / options / whatever, you're not scared of tough work but you're also loo…

Your compassion is distilled to crystal purity through these words. Thank you for sharing.

Thank you for the kind words. From where I am standing, I can completely sympathize with my parent commenter and I know how it feels like being stuck. I wish our society tried to help us treat all of this (because avoiding it in the first place seems to be too much to ask of it).

They are just words and I have no big hope they will help somebody but if they do, that will genuinely make me little happier.

Re: How to Work Hard

#904

Post by nicbou »

rustyboy wrote: post #518
nonbirithm wrote: post #414

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel the same. I can hardly sit through an entire two-hour movie or play a video game without feeling like I should be doing something else. I cannot feel good about myself if I cannot sense that I'm making progress learning a skill, and am stuck for hours looking down at a blank page as a result. But what's dangerous for me is that this alarm system does not trigger consistently. I might spend too much time on HN,…

Your description here, and others, eerily match my own angst with 'being productive'. As someone who has spent covid traveling the States in an RV i've come to realize that I don't know what I really like doing that's not work (for example I enjoy, but have no deep passion for, outdoors recreation). Instead I spend hours aggressively reading and writing reviews on books because that feeling, 'being productive' is the…

Travelling by motorcycle added a dimension to it. I always had to plan ahead, keep the bike running, find my next place to sleep, and generally make sure I'm not just driving through and missing everything. It's hard to just sit there when you don't carry your home with you.

It felt pretty productive, in the sense that your only idle time is riding the motorcycle, and the end-of-day beer and meal.

It felt rather silly to take a vacation from my vacation, but sometimes I just had to stop for a bit longer to recover. It really felt like work, but the kind that leaves you proud and fulfilled.

Re: How to Work Hard

#905

Post by Andy_G11 »

taneq wrote: post #853
Andy_G11 wrote: post #674

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Work is a drug and I seriously think it triggers some sort of endorphin response in the same way that exercise does. Unfortunately, many white collar types of work are insular and while you are sitting on front of a screen getting a buzz about solving little problems, or even quite big ones for specific issues, the world is moving on. It is possible that you may even be compromising your career by being good at the t…

> It is possible that you may even be compromising your career by being good at the technical issues of a job to the extent that some bosses who cannot stay on top of what you are doing may feel they would be more comfortable with a safe, matey colleague than a bit of a strange wizzkid who gets to be known as the oracle of all things. This is always a possibility... however in my experience things tend to fall more o…

True - I have seen this on a few occasions; sometimes the 'tucking away' includes a social element applied by overriding responses in conversations, making detracting remarks and generally casting shade over said whizzkid - boxing them in in the co's social as well as organisational hierarchy.

Re: How to Work Hard

#906

Post by Gatsky »

rgifford wrote: post #889
Gatsky wrote: post #881

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Note that everyone on this forum is prima facie remarkably privileged compared to someone in this world. 'We' all went to some kind of school as opposed to no school. 'We' all have amazing technology at our finger tips, as opposed to lacking basic nutrition and sanitation and personal safety. The difference between 'us' and the abject poor is much greater than the difference between 'us' and PG or Bill Gates. The abj…

It's an article called "How to Work Hard" that doesn't once mention luck, psychology, or basic human needs. What do you get from the success how-tos of multi-millionares? Do you really not see it as self-serving? Disclose survivorship bias, incredible privilege, and impossible odds and I'm in... I think? At that point I'm still unclear why the rich have something useful to say here that Maslow or other academics don'…

I've lost track of what your critique actually is. Anyway, I didn't read this essay because PG is rich. I do not in fact know if he is rich or not. His wealth neither increases nor decreases the likelihood that the essay is worthwile. I starting reading PG's essays because he made HN, which I find valuable, his net worth is irrelevant to me. I know about him because of HN, because of something he created, and for no other reason.

I am able to contextualise his essay myself. It is not necessary for him to start the essay with a laundry list of disclaimers (eg I'm a neurotypical rich white guy with good parents, no major medical conditions, good teeth, 4 limbs etc).

Re: How to Work Hard

#907

Post by PavleMiha »

stryker7001 wrote: post #883
WalterSear wrote: post #617

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unfortunately, I've been burnt out too many times now, for too long. Every job now ends in burn out and takes 6+ months to recover from before I can start looking for another job. This time, however, feels different - it never felt insurmountable like this before. I can't work on my own stuff, can't level up my skills, not sure how to get back to that. I suspect that my situation is likely common among aging coders a…

I feel bad for you. but eventually if you've failed 6 times, you have to look at yourself and understand what you're doing wrong. It actually sounds like you might have clinical depression, and that's not anything to take lightly. There is tons of help and support and if you want, I'd be happy to help.

I wouldn't say the fact that 6 startups that they worked on failed is their fault. A lot of startups fail.

Re: How to Work Hard

#908

Post by thisismyswamp »

rgifford wrote: post #867
hallway_monitor wrote: post #856

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nobody's to say. For some reason some people think that statistics dictate reality when obviously they just take an average. The zip code thingy is silly, but on average more expensive zip codes produce children with higher incomes.

Stats measure our shared experience. Is there something better for this? The human spirit isn't unconquerable. Believing it is has the side effect that you write off others because, "try harder." Vertasium did a fairly convincing bit on the zip code thing, which is -- I think -- why it's top of mind: https://youtu.be/3LopI4YeC4I I encourage you to dig into economic data and not use your experience as a frame of refer…

Statistics wash away any hint of individuality

Re: How to Work Hard

#909

Post by nickd2001 »

WalterSear wrote: post #569
nonbirithm wrote: post #414

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel the same. I can hardly sit through an entire two-hour movie or play a video game without feeling like I should be doing something else. I cannot feel good about myself if I cannot sense that I'm making progress learning a skill, and am stuck for hours looking down at a blank page as a result. But what's dangerous for me is that this alarm system does not trigger consistently. I might spend too much time on HN,…

This is me. Though I didn't just learn this in my upbringing - I feel like my entire working life has been one of false promises and dehumanization, that has left me unable to enjoy anything. I'm 47 now, have worked at 6 failed startups in a row, and can't face work, or looking for a job. I used to blame social media and hacker news, but I now recognize that too much delayed gratification and overwork have had a much…

6 failed startups in a row!! Sounds like recipe for burnout and depression. You may well have shown much resilience to not end up in a mental hospital after that. Which could be a good sign in terms of recovering from all this? (It may take time though) Why do people do this to themselves I wonder? Must've been super hard work, and for what? I guess, the hope of making it big? To achieve 'FU money'? Well, going forward from here, there are less stressful tech jobs... They don't pay as much, but... a not-very-well-paid software job is still overall a not badly paid job. As for ageism which you allude to in other post, can be a problem if all one's colleagues are much younger, depends on the environment of course. I'm a similar age to you, seems like if one has good (i:e in-demand, and of long-term value) skills, people generally don't mind one's age. My coping strategy with age (less energy and tiring responsibilities outside work) is look after your productivity super-powers e:g command-line, vim, which take years even decades to learn. Sometimes us oldies are more efficient than the younger ones even if they can put in more hours.

Re: How to Work Hard

#910

Post by nickd2001 »

I think this is a fantastic discussion, one of the best I ever read on HN. :) Its a provocative article, for sure! Very good for people to ask whether they should work hard, why they should work hard, and at what. A good recent example I feel of someone who works extremely hard and its 100% worth it, is Prof Sarah Gilbert, the person behind the Oxford-Astra-Zeneca covid vaccine, which BTW has a Malaria vaccine on the heels of it which would be amazing.
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