Germany passes Japan to have world's lowest birth rate • Hacker News Board

Re: Germany passes Japan to have world's lowest birth rate

#91

Post by ekianjo » Sun, May 31, 2015, 11:08 AM UTC

mafribe wrote: post #89

ekianjo wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not really. In the end Japanese will have to pay, in one way or another, and that will be either with huge taxation, or dramatic inflation. Or Default. No good options out there, really.

The Japanese can themselves decide which option to take, rather than being forced into one from the outside. The current elected government seems to have taken the route of inflating away the debt.

> The current elected government seems to have taken the route of inflating away the debt.

Yeah, and it's not a pretty way to go with solving the debt problem. This will result in higher prices for everyone, destroying savings and hurting in result the private sector. "Just" to save the government.

Re: Germany passes Japan to have world's lowest birth rate

#92

Post by mafribe » Sun, May 31, 2015, 11:11 AM UTC

Xixi wrote: post #13

Note that Japan fertility rate is not the worst out there: for instance Hong Kong (1.1), Singapore (1.2) and South Korea (1.2) are all bellow Japan (1.4).

Taiwan is estimated to have had a fertility rate of 1.1 in 2014, and that's up from 0.89 in 2010.

Re: Germany passes Japan to have world's lowest birth rate

#93

Post by makeitsuckless » Sun, May 31, 2015, 11:20 AM UTC

joshuapants wrote: post #14

mg1982 wrote: post #11

It's difficult not to see to the word 'slumped' as an editorial judgement, and I find it quite strange. The world is grotesquely overpopulated and at some point it needs to stop.

The world is not overpopulated by a long shot. There may be a lot of overconsumption in certain regions, but that's a different issue.

The world is overpopulated unless you consider humans the only relevant lifeforms on earth.

Re: Germany passes Japan to have world's lowest birth rate

#94

Post by crdoconnor » Sun, May 31, 2015, 11:24 AM UTC

jtzhou wrote: post #3

It is interesting how a country with a lot of seemingly positive aspects -- abundant natural resources and fresh water, temperate climate, stabile economy and low unemployment, and great infrastructure -- cannot convince its citizens to procreate, whereas a country like Yemen with little in development is exploding in population (doubling every 20 years). When given the choice, it seems humans have children more out…

I'm pretty sure that it's determined by optimism about the future. Germans think that the next generation will have it about the same or even slightly worse than them.

The Greatest Generation were absolutely positive that the future was going to be very bright once they returned home from the war, hence the baby boom and baby boomers.

Once you account for access to contraceptives, etc. (i.e. once childbearing becomes a choice), I think this is largely what determines the birthrate, which is why most efforts to 'engineer' a higher birthrate have been so futile.

Re: Germany passes Japan to have world's lowest birth rate

#95

Post by tiatia » Sun, May 31, 2015, 11:29 AM UTC

lizarazucharlie wrote: post #90

tiatia wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Labor costs and salaries are declining at a staggering pace. Workers get squeezed between declining wages, asset price inflation (Germany has one of the lowest house ownership rates) and taxation. The the same time, hordes of young, male, aggressive and uneducated immigrants who believe that they have a superior religion, flood Germany. Run as long as you can.

Uneducated you say, strange, I live and work in Germany as a software engineer in an IT company with 25 others immigrants, there isn't a SINGLE german there...

And you came via a boat from Africa as an illegal immigrant. Congratulations. Impressive. You must be the exception.

I am an immigrant for the second time. This time in Asia. But I did not come with a boat, did not clandestine cross the boarder, do not live on other peoples tax money and I have a valid work permit. I also don't harass the local population. If I did, they would throw me out faster than a rabbit gets fucked.

Re: Germany passes Japan to have world's lowest birth rate

#96

Post by lizarazucharlie » Sun, May 31, 2015, 11:47 AM UTC

tiatia wrote: post #95

lizarazucharlie wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Uneducated you say, strange, I live and work in Germany as a software engineer in an IT company with 25 others immigrants, there isn't a SINGLE german there...

And you came via a boat from Africa as an illegal immigrant. Congratulations. Impressive. You must be the exception. I am an immigrant for the second time. This time in Asia. But I did not come with a boat, did not clandestine cross the boarder, do not live on other peoples tax money and I have a valid work permit. I also don't harass the local population. If I did, they would throw me out faster than a rabbit gets f…

My point is without educated immigrants who pays the pension of old people, Germany would face a hard time.

"I also don't harass the local population". I am pretty sure they disagree, pushing people without saying "Entschuldigung" IS a harassment. How did the people on your city, on Asian, react to your more than 10 seconds out of blue stare? Didn't they think is is a harassment too?

Re: Germany passes Japan to have world's lowest birth rate

#97

Post by thanksgiving » Sun, May 31, 2015, 12:06 PM UTC

xienze wrote: post #25

k__ wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you assume a developed country, you have an attractive place to live for many people from other badly developed countries. So you can simply import them.

That brings with it its own problems, as many European countries are discovering.

Bring in wealthy people like the US experimented with by bringing in the Chinese.

Re: Germany passes Japan to have world's lowest birth rate

#98

Post by tiatia » Sun, May 31, 2015, 12:06 PM UTC

lizarazucharlie wrote: post #96

tiatia wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And you came via a boat from Africa as an illegal immigrant. Congratulations. Impressive. You must be the exception. I am an immigrant for the second time. This time in Asia. But I did not come with a boat, did not clandestine cross the boarder, do not live on other peoples tax money and I have a valid work permit. I also don't harass the local population. If I did, they would throw me out faster than a rabbit gets f…

My point is without educated immigrants who pays the pension of old people, Germany would face a hard time. "I also don't harass the local population". I am pretty sure they disagree, pushing people without saying "Entschuldigung" IS a harassment. How did the people on your city, on Asian, react to your more than 10 seconds out of blue stare? Didn't they think is is a harassment too?

I don't disagree that Germany needs skilled immigrants. But there is actually currently much less demand than some lobbyist claim and salaries are so low that mostly this is only attractive to 2nd class 3rd world immigrants. The very good ones go to the US, UK,CA or Australia immediately. Easier, much more pay.

Germany had immigrant waves from countries like Iran or Afghanistan some decades ago. But this were very highly educated people that fled due to the circumstances and were able AND WILLING to adapt.

The current African/Middle Eastern immigrants are not willing and probably not even able to adapt. "Harassment" was a polite correct way to speak of all the violence, rapes and sometimes murders that are committed.

Do you know the country with the highest cases of rapes? It is Sweden! Guess why? Yes, must be terrible people this tall blond Swedish Vikings raping their women....

Australia solved her immigration problem by just sending the people in the boats back home. Europe can not solve the problems of the world by accepting everyone that comes. In Germany, one of the most dense populated countries, alone 300.000-400.000 a year.

You can't have both. Free, unlimited immigration and social welfare. The people in Europe will have to make a decision about this.

Worse, this people are not solving their problems at home when they come but they import their problems into Europe.

Re: Germany passes Japan to have world's lowest birth rate

#99

Post by thanksgiving » Sun, May 31, 2015, 12:09 PM UTC

xaver wrote: post #85

jotm wrote: post #73

Can I just say that it is not a problem for Germany because they figured out they need to let immigrants in, unlike Japan. Germany has a very high number of immigrants, including (actually, mostly!) young adults who are eager to work. By all means, the country is more than safe in this regard, in stark contrast to Japan, which is trying to turn to robots for future workers (which is fine for the rest of the world, im…

How does that make it not a problem for Germany? Are you talking about Germany the landmass? Germany the state? Germany the nation or the ethnicity? Cause, I mean, sure its no problem for the landmass or the state. For the nation/ethnicity though, it means extinction.

Nations are not ethnicity. Did you mean culture?

Re: Germany passes Japan to have world's lowest birth rate

#100

Post by lorenzhs » Sun, May 31, 2015, 12:10 PM UTC

ajmurmann wrote: post #20

As a German who lives in the US since 8 years I am not surprised by this at all. By the time you finish university in Germany you are about 25 years old. They introduced the Bachelor/Master system, but at least when I studied, getting a Bachelor was more of a way to drop out gracefully. In addition there was a culture that expected you to stay at home until your child is at least 1 year old. Therefore there was very…

On the aspect of religion, this varies strongly by region. In the "neue Bundesländer" (former GDR), people are generally a lot less religious due to the GDR actively discouraging religion. Meanwhile, Bavaria is very catholic (and quite conservative). It would be interesting to see if/how religion and birth rate correlate in Germany.