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Curl, 17 years old today

daniel.haxx.se

91–100 of 100 posts

Re: Curl, 17 years old today

#91
post #85
post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On a serious note, “progressive enhancement – still the right way”. I don't think client-side rendering is going away but everyone who's relied on it exclusively has learned the hard way that it's just too unreliable and slow to have a failure mode which is an empty page unless a lot of complex code works perfectly. Just think about how many engineer-hours Twitter flushed with that silly #! kludge – and then when the…

>but everyone who's relied on it exclusively has learned the hard way that it's just too unreliable and slow to have a failure mode which is an empty page unless a lot of complex code works perfectly. FUD. I develop HTML5 gambling for a living and this anti-javascript sentiment on HN is getting really tiresome. You honestly sound like a bunch of old people, complaining that a PC isn't a typewriter or a fountain pen.…

You rather spectacularly missed the point: I wasn't saying not to do the fancy stuff but rather to start with something which degrades well and then have your JavaScript enhance that basic experience.

If you want to know why this is a good idea, you should start using something like getsentry.com or errorception.com to record your JavaScript errors. That won't tell you who couldn't execute JavaScript at all but it'll show how many times something didn't load due to a flaky ISP, adware, buggy anti-virus, odd browser settings, etc. With progressive enhancement, those people still have a reasonable chance of at least seeing the content on the page. With a pure JS approach, they're only going to see a blank and will probably be heading over to a competitor whose site degrades well.

(Note that this is only the question of the site working at all. In most cases, the progressive site will also render considerably faster – Twitter found an 80% improvement! – since the pure-JS approach breaks the browser's prefetch optimizations and requires much more work to achieve comparable performance)

Re: Curl, 17 years old today

#92
post #5

> Rough estimates say we may have a billion users already. This cannot be true by a long shot. Or am I missing something?

The most common language used on websites is PHP which uses libcurl to handle HTTP requests.

PHP applications may use libcurl when making outbound HTTP requests, right? That is only a small subset of these web sites. Most web sites just normally process HTTP requests.

This does not seem to explain the 1 billion users figure.

Re: Curl, 17 years old today

#93
post #70
post #5

> Rough estimates say we may have a billion users already. This cannot be true by a long shot. Or am I missing something?

Isn't it installed on OS X by default?

I don't know but just having it installed as part of OS distribution doesn't really count as "user", now does it?

Re: Curl, 17 years old today

#94
post #35

I love curl so much. I just learned that you can 'copy to curl command' from the chrome inspector's network panel by right clicking on any request!! I want to make a library that reads the curl command (and maybe request syntax?) and outputs a function that will do that command.

Similarly you can right-click and "Copy as cURL" from the Network pane of Firefox's web developer tools.

You can also edit requests and resend them from the FF dev tools. Alas, you can't (yet) do that from the Chrome dev tools.

Re: Curl, 17 years old today

#97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The most common language used on websites is PHP which uses libcurl to handle HTTP requests.

PHP applications may use libcurl when making outbound HTTP requests, right? That is only a small subset of these web sites. Most web sites just normally process HTTP requests. This does not seem to explain the 1 billion users figure.

WordPress uses libcurl, according to a google search there are 74,652,825 sites using WordPress. How many unique visitors do you think these sites get? I would guess over a billion.

Re: Curl, 17 years old today

#98
post #17

And still better than wget, which only does http 1.0 and this has problems due to lacking a 'host' header. Curl just works.

Being this misinformed takes effort. I take it you haven't used wget the last decade?

It was a simple mistake, but the 1.1 support was added in 2011: http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wget

Re: Curl, 17 years old today

#99
post #85
post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On a serious note, “progressive enhancement – still the right way”. I don't think client-side rendering is going away but everyone who's relied on it exclusively has learned the hard way that it's just too unreliable and slow to have a failure mode which is an empty page unless a lot of complex code works perfectly. Just think about how many engineer-hours Twitter flushed with that silly #! kludge – and then when the…

>but everyone who's relied on it exclusively has learned the hard way that it's just too unreliable and slow to have a failure mode which is an empty page unless a lot of complex code works perfectly. FUD. I develop HTML5 gambling for a living and this anti-javascript sentiment on HN is getting really tiresome. You honestly sound like a bunch of old people, complaining that a PC isn't a typewriter or a fountain pen.…

> I develop HTML5 gambling for a living and this anti-javascript sentiment on HN is getting really tiresome.

I've been using websites since the early 90s and this pro-single-page sentiment is getting really tiresome. You are breaking the web. You are destroying users' security.

Sure, there are plenty of reasons to use JavaScript, and plenty of places where it's appropriate. It probably is a good idea for games and so forth. But requiring users to load and execute constantly-changing code from across the web in order to read a page or submit a form is in-friggin-sane.

Some one else pointed out that it'd be nice if browsers offered more support for things that certain types of developers clearly want to do. I completely agree; it'd definitely be nice to take advantage of many of the technologies which currently exist to do more, in a more structured way. But requiring code execution in order to read data is madness.

Re: Curl, 17 years old today

#100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

PHP applications may use libcurl when making outbound HTTP requests, right? That is only a small subset of these web sites. Most web sites just normally process HTTP requests. This does not seem to explain the 1 billion users figure.

WordPress uses libcurl, according to a google search there are 74,652,825 sites using WordPress. How many unique visitors do you think these sites get? I would guess over a billion.

Oh come on, you just don't get it do you?

Just because Wordpress, which is a blog platform, uses libcurl for something you didn't even state (probably some outbound http stuff), doesn't mean it uses it to process most of the incoming requests for the millions of users.

We don't say Solitare is the most successful game ever just because it's installed with every copy of Windows.

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