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My Roommate, the Darknet Drug Lord

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Re: My Roommate, the Darknet Drug Lord

#91

Post by frozenport »

lectrick wrote: post #80
Lawtonfogle wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it really victimless? I'll admit that for something like pot, that is responsibly grown and used, there is no victims (well maybe with second hand smoke, but you get that just as much from cigarettes). But many drugs being sold do not come responsible producers. Instead, they come from groups that cause a lot of harm in order to acquire the money from selling those drugs. Yes, legalizing responsible production wou…

> Instead, they come from groups that cause a lot of harm in order to acquire the money from selling those drugs. Yes, legalizing responsible production would largely fix this problem, but a current purchase still funds a horrible group. So basically, to rephrase, the existence of the law is what makes the law necessary. It's almost tautological. IF it were treated as a public health problem (Portugal apparently did…

>>IF it were treated as a public health problem

Or if it were punished by death, like in Singapore.

Re: My Roommate, the Darknet Drug Lord

#92

Post by frozenport »

simplicio wrote: post #62
arca_vorago wrote: post #43

The main thing I would like to know is why did he hire the lawyer he did? His defense basically sold him up the river, as can be seen from the scathing comments from the judge. Is it still a fair trial if your lawyer is incompetent?

It's possible to get a re-trial on the grounds of incompetent defence, but the bar is really high. And since Ulbricht is still using the same lawyer for his appeals, it doesn't look like he's trying that route. His defense did seem pretty poor, but given the amount of evidence against him, its not really clear what a "good defense" would've looked like.

Maybe borrow from OJ Simpson, repeatedly fail to login into the Silk Road admin panel, have him swear to find the real DPR, demand a jury of like-minded libertarian drug dealers?

Re: My Roommate, the Darknet Drug Lord

#93

Post by [deleted] »

simplicio wrote: post #62
arca_vorago wrote: post #43

The main thing I would like to know is why did he hire the lawyer he did? His defense basically sold him up the river, as can be seen from the scathing comments from the judge. Is it still a fair trial if your lawyer is incompetent?

It's possible to get a re-trial on the grounds of incompetent defence, but the bar is really high. And since Ulbricht is still using the same lawyer for his appeals, it doesn't look like he's trying that route. His defense did seem pretty poor, but given the amount of evidence against him, its not really clear what a "good defense" would've looked like.

[deleted]

Re: My Roommate, the Darknet Drug Lord

#94

Post by 67726e »

rottencupcakes wrote: post #26
api wrote: post #21

"I felt relieved: gone was the posturing so obvious in the previous candidates. They worked in advertising, at startups—Twitter employees who talked about how much money they made and the exotic locales where they took their vacations. Ross was a techie, but he didn't act like one. He seemed eloquent, optimistic, down-to-earth. He seemed trustworthy." As an aside, that's a sad little bit of commentary on the tech sce…

What an absurd statement by the author. These people were interviewing for an apartment in a notoriously tough housing market - they were probably just "posturing" (mentioning their good jobs and money) because they thought it would help them get the apartment. He sounds like an outlier of a landlord who prefers a sketchy semi-employed roommate to one with a guaranteed salary.

Did you read TFA? It says they were both subletters and were not on the same lease. He wasn't a landlord, he wasn't on the hook for Ulbrich's half of the rent. He wanted a friend, not a tool for a roommate.

Re: My Roommate, the Darknet Drug Lord

#95

Post by joe_the_user »

runjake wrote: post #18
robbyking wrote: post #15

This is a bit of an aside, but this line really stung: >> Ross was a techie, but he didn't act like one. He seemed eloquent, optimistic, down-to-earth. One of the main reasons I got into software development in the 90's was the fact that software engineers were (largely) eloquent, optimistic, and down-to-earth. It's sad that a vocal minority has sullied the image of an entire industry.

Virtually every niche of society considers others of their kind as eloquent, optimistic, and down-to-earth. This is a common perception in a group of people with shared passions. From artists, techies, to politicians and even Nazi Germany.

Well,

If you read what the author wrote, he implied that as outside observer he found software engineer eloquent, optimistic and down-to-earth. So he wasn't just reflecting group bias.

I got into software engineer by finding software engineer down-to-earth at least in the sense that it seemed you didn't have to engage in the posturing implicit in finance, say.

That seems to be gone in Silicone Valley but that might be only a small sample of the whole software world.

Re: My Roommate, the Darknet Drug Lord

#96

Post by krapp »

ocb wrote: post #47
Lawtonfogle wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it really victimless? I'll admit that for something like pot, that is responsibly grown and used, there is no victims (well maybe with second hand smoke, but you get that just as much from cigarettes). But many drugs being sold do not come responsible producers. Instead, they come from groups that cause a lot of harm in order to acquire the money from selling those drugs. Yes, legalizing responsible production wou…

I have no evidence for this, but I think that your chances of funding a violent group with your purchase would be significantly lower on a dark net market than if you made the purchase on the street.

If darknets are profitable, what's to stop existing drug cartels from becoming involved with them?

Re: My Roommate, the Darknet Drug Lord

#97

Post by Retra »

msandford wrote: post #88
Retra wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a terrible argument. Imagine you just made that threat to me. I will say "No. And if you come after me, I will just turn you in to the feds." And now you're almost assuredly going to jail, which is what you were trying to avoid in the first place. This is a quick way to stick yourself in an impossible-to-win situation and violate everyone's trust. Anyway, the 'government guy' happened to keep records of what w…

> "No. And if you come after me, I will just turn you in to the feds." Ok so you're going to turn the other guy in to the feds for what exactly? How do you know this other guy? Why would him turning you in to the feds be a problem, unless you're doing something illegal? DPR: He this guy is doing something bad, arrest him! Feds: How do you know he's doing something bad? DPR: Well I run the Silk Road and he told me tha…

It's not a clever argument, it's just the better of two options. If we are killing the guy because he might turn us in, then I should also just kill you because you've threatened to turn me in. There is no way that is a winning proposition for anybody, so it doesn't guarantee any safety for anyone.

If you're willing to kill someone to avoid jail, you better believe I would be willing to turn you in if you've already decided to turn me in because I don't want to kill someone. If we DO kill them, then by the same logic, I should have you killed to.

Threatening the person you are working with to "deal with threats" is just stupid. It just means you have to be dealt with as well.

Re: My Roommate, the Darknet Drug Lord

#98

Post by msane »

mindslight wrote: post #31
chatmasta wrote: post #2

"Sure, we wanted Ross to go free. We wanted him to be innocent, to be a hero: the poster boy for privacy in the Information Age." That may be partially true, but Ross polluted much of the goodwill the Internet community had for him when he decided to "order a hitman." I doubt he was ever that serious about hiring one. If you read the chats he had, he sounds completely out of his league, and probably never would have…

To be fair, contract killing is straight out of The Cyphernomicon . When the incumbent justice system shuns you, the remaining avenue of settling things is the old fashioned way. I primarily see him as yet another casualty of the drug war - if the law were congruent with morality, he would have respected the institution more to begin with instead of doubling down on a conspiracy.

So you're saying the justice system has some flaw(s) which make it not "congruent with morality", not being specific, so it's ok to put hits out on people?

Re: My Roommate, the Darknet Drug Lord

#99

Post by mindslight »

msane wrote: post #98
mindslight wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be fair, contract killing is straight out of The Cyphernomicon . When the incumbent justice system shuns you, the remaining avenue of settling things is the old fashioned way. I primarily see him as yet another casualty of the drug war - if the law were congruent with morality, he would have respected the institution more to begin with instead of doubling down on a conspiracy.

So you're saying the justice system has some flaw(s) which make it not "congruent with morality", not being specific, so it's ok to put hits out on people?

Nope, try a different straw man.

It's pretty obvious that the specific incongruence I'm talking about is persecution of drugs.

Incongruence undermines respect for the rule of law in general (cf. "stop snitching"). It changes the calculus from "should I transgress against what society deems sacred" to "I'm already in trouble with the biggest gang around, might as well keep going".

Re: My Roommate, the Darknet Drug Lord

#100

Post by aianus »

krapp wrote: post #96
ocb wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have no evidence for this, but I think that your chances of funding a violent group with your purchase would be significantly lower on a dark net market than if you made the purchase on the street.

If darknets are profitable, what's to stop existing drug cartels from becoming involved with them?

Existing drug cartels have a great competitive advantage in violence, intimidation, and smuggling. None of those skills are particularly useful in competing with anonymous rivals on Silk Road.
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