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An Offer to Sony from 2600

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Re: An Offer to Sony from 2600

#91

Post by MarkMc »

b3tta wrote: post #57
indymike wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Burning a Koran, just to fuck with people, is probably in "yelling fire" territory." I hope not. Making capitulation to a threat, implied or explicit would be the exact opposite of freedom of speech. You would not be able to speak out against... anything.

Well… The difference is the implied meaning of burning a book. Making a movie about the assassination of the NK leader doesn't imply hate. I'm pretty sure making the movie wasn't about the hate against NK per se, but rather a comedy about the situation in an oppressed country. If you burn a koran/bible I'm pretty sure we all know what that means: You hate the religion and wan't it to die. As you can see the differenc…

What about burning just the pages of the Koran that condone slavery. Is that still hate speech?

Re: An Offer to Sony from 2600

#92

Post by lemma »

acmecorps wrote: post #70
nicobn wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I understand the sentiment behind your comment but applying this doctrine does more good than harm. The right to not be offended, quite simply, does not exist and should not exist in free democracies. Everything should be open for debate, discussion, parody, etc.. Not producing a movie because someone might feel insulted by it and then throw a temper tantrum is censorship by proxy in its purest form. The tyranny of s…

> The right to not be offended, quite simply, does not exist and should not exist in free democracies Genuine question: Why is that?

Because it necessarily limits the far more important right of free expression.

Re: An Offer to Sony from 2600

#93

Post by srj »

zaroth wrote: post #12
logn wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Now we want you never let the movie released, distributed or leaked in any form of, for instance, DVD or piracy. And we want everything related to the movie, including its trailers, as well as its full version down from any website hosting them immediately." If only we had passed SOPA and CISPA, we'd be so much safer right now.

If anything I think this shows how poorly the US Gov is prepared for cyber-warfare. The last decade was no cake walk, but the next decade will truly be eye opening. The FBI told Sony they didn't know if the theaters were safe. Seriously, WTF are we paying them for if they can't tell us, with absolute certainty, that our theaters are safe from terrorist attacks on Christmas. That's not very comforting... So what I'm h…

The notion that a computer hacking threat and the threat of physical harm are somehow in the same ballpark is completely without merit and absurd. There's not the slightest evidence that the hackers could physically harm someone beyond the capabilities that any person in this world possesses.

Further the actual damage in this case is quite minor. Some of Sony's private business dealings were made public and some employees were embarrassed, but what other harm could you possibly see? Businesses have been online for 10-15 years now and computer security has improved dramatically over that time. We're not in any new era of capability, though with the amount of hysteria over this we may be in a new one mentally.

The only real threat is in our government marching towards totalitarianism by enacting invasive laws and spying on its populace in bulk. Unwarranted fear likes yours is what enables that.

Re: An Offer to Sony from 2600

#94

Post by lemma »

q2 wrote: post #73
zaroth wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think this shows a fundamental misunderstanding of the basic meaning of artistic expression, freedom of speech, and censorship. I find that I am diametrically opposed to everything that you have stated. This also really has nothing to do with a silly little movie called "The Interview". The movie is a footnote in a brutal attack on Sony which left their entire network destroyed, their PCs wiped, their entire data s…

Whatever happened on Sony is bad, no doubt in that. >>> As for peaceful co-existence and all that, such a thing can only be possible not by retaliating when we are offended, but by understanding we have a right to be offended, and a right to express our outrage peacefully and constructively. I would like to see examples of this approach getting succeeded between different countries with different scales/opinions on j…

You are comparing attacks that killed thousands to a movie?

Re: An Offer to Sony from 2600

#95

Post by connie_lingus »

The CIA report threatens our legitimacy as a world power.

no it does not...almost everyone in the world understand that under certain conditions, torture to get potentially life-saving information is just the way of things.

let me put it this way...if your immediate family was going to be blown up in two hours, wouldn't you say go ahead and torture that guy who you KNOW has information on how to diffuse the bomb?

Re: An Offer to Sony from 2600

#96

Post by xtrumanx »

connie_lingus wrote: post #95

The CIA report threatens our legitimacy as a world power. no it does not...almost everyone in the world understand that under certain conditions, torture to get potentially life-saving information is just the way of things. let me put it this way...if your immediate family was going to be blown up in two hours, wouldn't you say go ahead and torture that guy who you KNOW has information on how to diffuse the bomb?

I'm not sure I would. It's scary me that you're sure that you would.

Re: An Offer to Sony from 2600

#97

Post by happyscrappy »

kyledrake wrote: post #75

The last time people got this crazy about a hack, Kevin Mitnick was thrown in solitary confinement for months because they thought he could "whistle nuclear launch codes into prison telephones". 2600 made the documentary about it, Freedom Downtime, and I strongly recommend watching it if you never have. So what if North Korea did it (of course I'm skeptical of this, anyone with a computer can conduct the same activit…

Only someone who has never run a business can be in favor of more crackers and script kiddies.

Re: An Offer to Sony from 2600

#98

Post by connie_lingus »

xtrumanx wrote: post #96
connie_lingus wrote: post #95

The CIA report threatens our legitimacy as a world power. no it does not...almost everyone in the world understand that under certain conditions, torture to get potentially life-saving information is just the way of things. let me put it this way...if your immediate family was going to be blown up in two hours, wouldn't you say go ahead and torture that guy who you KNOW has information on how to diffuse the bomb?

I'm not sure I would. It's scary me that you're sure that you would.

you would allow your parents and children to be blown up rather than make a horrid criminal be very uncomfortable for a few minutes????

and i'm the nutty one?

Re: An Offer to Sony from 2600

#99

Post by mr_luc »

acmecorps wrote: post #70
nicobn wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I understand the sentiment behind your comment but applying this doctrine does more good than harm. The right to not be offended, quite simply, does not exist and should not exist in free democracies. Everything should be open for debate, discussion, parody, etc.. Not producing a movie because someone might feel insulted by it and then throw a temper tantrum is censorship by proxy in its purest form. The tyranny of s…

> The right to not be offended, quite simply, does not exist and should not exist in free democracies Genuine question: Why is that?

It seems straightforward from here:

Because empirically, history seems to tell us that very many people will always be "offended" by others disagreeing with them, or living/worshipping/looking differently.

And so if there were a right to not be offended, it would trample many of the fundamental human freedoms we associate with democracies.

Blacks and whites marrying offended some people. The River Brethren not going to war offended some people. And in this specific case? Black humor isn't that rate; Arsenic and Old Lace, man. I'm sure that offended some people.

The right to be offended probably can't exist in free democracies.

Re: An Offer to Sony from 2600

#100

Post by superfx »

connie_lingus wrote: post #95

The CIA report threatens our legitimacy as a world power. no it does not...almost everyone in the world understand that under certain conditions, torture to get potentially life-saving information is just the way of things. let me put it this way...if your immediate family was going to be blown up in two hours, wouldn't you say go ahead and torture that guy who you KNOW has information on how to diffuse the bomb?

The most damning aspect of the CIA report is that none of what you're claiming was true. There was no ticking time bomb scenario, and there was no critical information extracted. In fact, the information the CIA did obtain from prisoners was later shown to be false.
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