Sometimes, it’s just time to go home • Hacker News Board

Re: Sometimes, it’s just time to go home

#91

Post by mtbcoder » Fri, Nov 07, 2014, 1:16 PM UTC

famousactress wrote: post #24

The saddest thing about this post to me is the fact that he could only write it because his startup is apparently doing great. Most startups aren't, despite the fact that lots of the folks there are in effectively the same personal position and feeling the exact same thing - in addition to the added pressure of not feeling like they measure up to stories like this one because their quarter didn't go nearly as well. I…

> The saddest thing about this post to me is the fact that he could only write it because his startup is apparently doing great.

Agreed.

> Most startups aren't, despite the fact that lots of the folks there are in effectively the same personal position and feeling the exact same thing - in addition to the added pressure of not feeling like they measure up to stories like this one because their quarter didn't go nearly as well. I really feel for those people, and I wish they felt more freedom to be honest and public about these kinds of feelings.

...and let's also not forget all the folks who are barely making ends meet at their existing jobs, putting in 60+ hour work weeks for a measly salary that's been stagnate for years or all the folks needing to work an extra job or two just to survive.

Re: Sometimes, it’s just time to go home

#92

Post by prof_hobart » Fri, Nov 07, 2014, 1:30 PM UTC

coldtea wrote: post #84

prof_hobart wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For most people a vanishingly small amount of life is now. Most of it has either already happened, or more importantly is still to come. I agree that there's a need to balance the now and planning for the future, and an awful lot of start ups seem, at least to me, to get the balance badly wrong. But there are often sacrifices you need to do now to gain far bigger rewards in the future. Whether that's resisting that d…

> For most people a vanishingly small amount of life is now. Most of it has either already happened, or more importantly is still to come. "Now" is a "rolling window". Lost 'nows" also agrregate.

It is, but acting as if the current "now" is the only thing that matters leads to very short term thinking, which often ends up with bad long term consequences.

Re: Sometimes, it’s just time to go home

#93

Post by unclebucknasty » Fri, Nov 07, 2014, 1:31 PM UTC

alexbecker wrote: post #45

unclebucknasty wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I read the following from link 2 in your comment: http://www.feld.com/archives/2014/10/helps-depressed.html This may be veering off-topic, but reading the suggestions submitted by the reader in that post made me wonder some people (many, in fact) have to actively work so hard to hold off depression. Something is going wrong (organically, culturally, or both) that depression is the default state for so many. Culturall…

> Something is going wrong (organically, culturally, or both) that depression is the default state for so many. I'm not convinced that this is any different from the "natural state" of humans (which granted is not completely well-defined). I do not see any reason to expect people to be generally happy. While it's overly reductionist to think of evolution in terms of individual "fitness", it is not clear to me that a…

From a strict evolutionary fitness perspective, depression is very nearly catastrophic. But, that framing doesn't make sense in the first place, nor is it necessary in order to assess the "natural state" of humans.

Depression is a mental health issue. Unhealthiness is not a natural state.

You are also profoundly misguided in your understanding that depression is the opposite of happiness. Most of your argument seems to rest on that confusion.

Re: Sometimes, it’s just time to go home

#94

Post by eitally » Fri, Nov 07, 2014, 1:34 PM UTC

hudibras wrote: post #31

birken wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is not the reality of what is required to do great things [1]. This is one path, but there are many others. There are lots of people who work 40-50 hours a week and have incredibly successful startups/companies/whatever. There are people who work 80 hours a week and their startup is a complete piece of garbage. Jamie Zawinski has a great great blog post about this [2], which I'll quote part of: > He's trying to…

Thanks, I hadn't read that jwz post before. This is another killer quote: >But the people who made 100x as much as the engineers did? I can tell you for a fact that none of them slept under their desk.

They didn't sleep under their desk, but they may well have spend 80% of their nights in hotels, which is worse (imho).

Re: Sometimes, it’s just time to go home

#95

Post by edpichler » Fri, Nov 07, 2014, 1:36 PM UTC

The best path is the middle.

I learned this in some book about Buddhism. We must have a balanced life. Life is a long trip. The end is the objective and, of course, very important, but we also need to enjoy the travel.

Re: Sometimes, it’s just time to go home

#96

Post by seletz » Fri, Nov 07, 2014, 1:47 PM UTC

So I'll stop to pretend to "be at the office" now and actually go home to see my kids. No joke.

Re: Sometimes, it’s just time to go home

#97

Post by benjaminwootton » Fri, Nov 07, 2014, 1:52 PM UTC

Great article. I've been doing a startup this year and despite best intentions it really does take a toll on yourself and people around you.

Re: Sometimes, it’s just time to go home

#98

Post by prof_hobart » Fri, Nov 07, 2014, 1:56 PM UTC

calinet6 wrote: post #86

prof_hobart wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For most people a vanishingly small amount of life is now. Most of it has either already happened, or more importantly is still to come. I agree that there's a need to balance the now and planning for the future, and an awful lot of start ups seem, at least to me, to get the balance badly wrong. But there are often sacrifices you need to do now to gain far bigger rewards in the future. Whether that's resisting that d…

There is a balance to everything. Sometimes the balance is in the opposite direction from your assumptions. If I've learned anything, it's that the really important things you're talking about—those get done. They have my focus for most of every day, and I care deeply about them. I don't let them hit the floor. The things that are missed are the ones I put out of mind to do that; that are broader than my current focu…

> If I've learned anything, it's that the really important things you're talking about—those get done.

And if I've learned anything by looking at obesity, people stuck in an ever downward spiral of payday loans, people who never saved for their pensions etc, they frequently don't.

> Ironically, the very things that would help its success most are the ones that fly out the window as soon as the going gets tough.

Indeed. That's a great example of companies living for the now. "Who cares about whether my employee will be off with stress in a month's time? That's the future and I'll let future me worry about that. I need this bit of work out now."

Like I say, and I think you're agreeing, it's about balance. What it's not about (which is what I was challenging) is always living for the now.

Re: Sometimes, it’s just time to go home

#99

Post by lazyant » Fri, Nov 07, 2014, 2:02 PM UTC

Htsthbjig wrote: post #71

When I was young I met a Spanish tennis player called Rafael Nadal when he was a kid. He was managed and coached by his uncle who had experience in being a professional football player. What shocked me is that he did not sacrifice Rafael's life like most of other kids that could be good(examples like Michael Jackson or in tennis the Wiilians' sisters or Arantxa Sanchez Vicario in Spain). At the time everybody believe…

> Rafael got to be the best Spanish player of all time.

Easily considered the world's 2nd best tennis player ever, with chances of being the best tennis player ever.

Re: Sometimes, it’s just time to go home

#100

Post by wellboy » Fri, Nov 07, 2014, 2:29 PM UTC

Htsthbjig wrote: post #71

When I was young I met a Spanish tennis player called Rafael Nadal when he was a kid. He was managed and coached by his uncle who had experience in being a professional football player. What shocked me is that he did not sacrifice Rafael's life like most of other kids that could be good(examples like Michael Jackson or in tennis the Wiilians' sisters or Arantxa Sanchez Vicario in Spain). At the time everybody believe…

Excellent story.

While I think it's worth throwing oneself into a startup for a few years, because there are learnings you will get this way, that you will never get anywhere else, there should be a long term vision.

The story of Rafael Nadal is great and applies to startups 100%, because the best founder is the one who has a balanced life and can make use of all of his creativity. A startup founder who doesn't have a life besides the startup, simply won't create a huge startup. Yes, they might be able to make a few hundred million, but they won't be the ones creating a transformative startup.