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Troubled welds on the Bay Bridge

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91–100 of 126 posts

Re: Troubled welds on the Bay Bridge

#91

Having studied in China, and worked in construction, all I can say is that this smells, far and wide, like there was some kickback somewhere in this process. I'm guessing on the Chinese soil end of things. From first hand experience, I know it happens on American soil all the time as well, but, from what little I saw in 1999 the Chinese culture of kickback in China takes it to a whole new level. Also, can somebody ex…

One return flight in Business or First could easily hit that?

For example, first class round trip from Washington to Beijing is typically about $25,000. Business class is more reasonable, but still high. Economy is already $1,200 or more.

Re: Troubled welds on the Bay Bridge

#92

Having studied in China, and worked in construction, all I can say is that this smells, far and wide, like there was some kickback somewhere in this process. I'm guessing on the Chinese soil end of things. From first hand experience, I know it happens on American soil all the time as well, but, from what little I saw in 1999 the Chinese culture of kickback in China takes it to a whole new level. Also, can somebody ex…

It's a single roundtrip in business class. And if you're flying to Shanghai and back once a month for several years on end , like he clearly did in 2010-2011, doing it all in economy is pretty brutal. Also, the $10k is an outlier, and might well be two trips in a single month. The vast majority of his fares were under $5k, and there are some visits under $2k.

The plane tickets and accommodations are just populist fodder. It sounds like an asskicker of a project and some luxury isn't that bad. The screwed up welds and cracks scare the hell out of me though, that's the real story.

Re: Troubled welds on the Bay Bridge

#93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not at all. You apparently didn't read the article. "Caltrans employees and U.S. contractors who supervised the job lived fulltime in Shanghai, and top officials flew there often. Tony Anziano, toll bridge program manager, alone spent more than $300,000 on travel. "Part of that cost was for Anziano’s room at the five-star JW Marriott Shanghai Tomorrow Square for up to $470 per night, according to his expense reports.…

I don't actually find the hotel price to be necessarily offensive in the absence of any other information... in foreign countries, you often have to pay a premium to get American-standard lodging (if it's even available).

Shanghai is more or less a first-world city these days. American-style hotels will not be hard to find. Your "if it's even available" parenthetical may be true in general but is rather absurd in this particular context.

Re: Troubled welds on the Bay Bridge

#94

I feel that the title is misleading. Caltrans faulted by practicing terrible project management. If someone underbids the next contractor by $250 million on a job they've never done before, you're supposed to politely laugh them out of the room. Edit: for the benefit of those now arriving, the title and link have been changed.

> If someone underbids the next contractor by $250 million on a job they've never done before, you're supposed to politely laugh them out of the room. Most of the time, you can't, at least not for government projects. Because of procurement laws and rules (designed, among other things, to allegedly be transparent and to provide accountability), a government body is required to accept the lowest bid from the contracto…

The obvious counter to this, and it's built-in to the process, is the "past qualifications" requirement. If your company has never built a bridge, they should have been disqualified from the bidding process via F.A.R.

The usual workaround for this is in IT is to sub-contract the necessary portions to those with said experience, so that the packaged team has the experience as a whole, but while that might seem like a loophole, it generally isn't bad because it means that the ones with the experience are the ones doing the work that requires the experience.

Admittedly, this isn't federal, and I don't know how what the bidding requirements are for state work, but if there's no disqualifier for "never done this before", heaven help the state of California.

Re: Troubled welds on the Bay Bridge

#95
post #77

What a fiasco. This story just keeps getting bigger and bigger. So many lessons to be learned about a flawed bidding and construction process. And from what I see, it's immune to politics. No party can take the higher ground. Public sector graft and private sector lying, cheating and thieving, both need to be stopped and big, small government, or running government like a business doesn't seem to help. Instead, worki…

Sounds like exactly what I would have recommended when the sub-prime market caused Wall Street's collapse ... people should have gone to jail but instead received performance bonuses. Executives who directed the bridge construction seem to have landed cushy non-government jobs instead, but the level of corruption and blame-shifting amazes me in both cases.

In both cases the behavior was enabled and encouraged by the government regulators. Should they also go to prison?

Re: Troubled welds on the Bay Bridge

#97
post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lucky for you, it's baked in to every modern web browser in existence - just look to the right for a built in progress bar that even lets you click to a particular section of the article based on it's progress.

I know it's hard to resist making snarky comments, but you jumped on it a bit too early, and I'm afraid you missed the point. My comment was specifically about It's about the fact that the bar is at the top of the page. It's a completely different user experience than the standard scroll bar.

How is it a completely different user experience?

Re: Troubled welds on the Bay Bridge

#98

What a fiasco. This story just keeps getting bigger and bigger. So many lessons to be learned about a flawed bidding and construction process. And from what I see, it's immune to politics. No party can take the higher ground. Public sector graft and private sector lying, cheating and thieving, both need to be stopped and big, small government, or running government like a business doesn't seem to help. Instead, worki…

It is really time that a new form of government is developed. It simply does not work this way and, in many ways, at the very least, the current form of democracy is insufficient and incapable of providing proper accountability.

There really needs to be some sort of tie to performance. It obviously cannot be the same kind of tie to civilian/private performance, especially since even that system in this country is grotesquely inadequate. Your motivations should be that your retirement and success is directly pinned to some metric and system of government competition and accountability.

I think the first step would be to separate and limit raising revenues, i.e., taxes, from spending revenues. The legislative function in the whole vertical structure of the government needs to be separated into a fourth branch. It is bone-headedly ridiculous that those who decide on what to spend money, also decide how much to spend, and where that money will come from.

There are so many humongous flaws in our governmental structure that violate so many basic auditing, risk, and accounting principles; it's absolutely ridiculous.

This is far deeper than just the acquisition or bidding process. This goes down deep into the core fundamental premises of our governmental and even social structure. It is a deep flaw that was revolutionary in the agricultural era it was devised in, but simply is far beyond inadequate for today's world.

Re: Troubled welds on the Bay Bridge

#99

What a fiasco. This story just keeps getting bigger and bigger. So many lessons to be learned about a flawed bidding and construction process. And from what I see, it's immune to politics. No party can take the higher ground. Public sector graft and private sector lying, cheating and thieving, both need to be stopped and big, small government, or running government like a business doesn't seem to help. Instead, worki…

I am trying to understand how this fiasco is any different from Boston's big dig? Are we just posturing because it was a Chinese company? Neither was bid/priced right and both have/had safety problems. Welcome to the world of government contracts, big projects tend to be vastly different than what is proposed or agreed too. Hence I am confused as to why the controversy this time.

Are you implying that there wasn't controversy over the Big Dig? I remember plenty.

Re: Troubled welds on the Bay Bridge

#100
post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unless the fines are 2-3 times the amount stolen. That would cut into the legitimate portion of their income and likely be a strong deterrent.

You have a very small chance of being caught if you ride the subway without a ticket. If you are caught some countries will work out what to fine you by multiplying the chance of being caught by the price of the ticket you didn't buy. So if they check your ticket once every 100 times you catch a train the fine for not having a ticket will be more than 100 times the cost of the ticket. That way not buying a ticket wor…

The train example is very informative because if you don't price the fine high enough you encourage people not to buy tickets. There actually was a mob-run "insurance" plan for train riders in India. The fine was about 20x the ticket price, but you would only be asked to show your ticket about every 100-200 rides. So you could buy half priced tickets from the mob and then they would reimburse you for any fines you paid while riding with their ticket.
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